2016 Accord face lift and still has V6 with MT

[John McCoy]

Leon wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Well, it's actually not. The source is the combustion chamber inside the engine. The air blowing back from the radiator is hitting the outside of the engine, seperated from the source by the engine block and water jacket. And, in practice of course most of the air goes under the vehicle anyway.

Simple - no oxygen. As long as the tank is full of gas vapors, it's not full of air.

Well, we're kind of looking at two different things there. One is the ability of the radiator to extract heat from the engine. Passenger car radiators aren't big enough to extract all the heat produced at full power.

The other is the ability of the radiator to reject heat to the atmosphere. That is very dependent on the speed of the air moving thru the radiator, and if there's no air movement it's close to zero heat rejection. Hence the fan to produce air movement while the vehicle is stationary.

Not so at all. A sport bike engine is much more enclosed in the bodywork than an automobile engine. It's different, of course, if you're talking about a Harley or other bike with no bodywork.

Well, any engine putting out a given horsepower is working just as hard as any other engine putting out the same horsepower. That's inherent in the definition of power. But I'll grant you that at idle, a car engine is working harder than a bike engine is.

John

[John McCoy]

Doug Winterburn wrote in news:55b3caac$0$57818$c3e8da3$ [e-mail]:

What's happening there is that hot air is less dense than cold air, so with the hot radiator air going into the engine, there was less mass of air for combustion and thus less power out.

Since you were trying to go up a hill you started pressing the accellerator pedal harder, putting more fuel to the engine to make more power to compensate. Too much fuel means the exhaust gas temps go up. Odds are you were also making smoke at that point.

1300 sounds very hot to me, but perhaps the little diesels are different (if nothing else, the pyrometer is probably closer to the exhaust port in the head).

John

[krw]

a. If air is going into the radiator and engine compartment, it is also going out.

b. The air going through the radiator is still cooler than the engine (so it is not adding heat to the engine).

No oxygen = no boom.

They have electric fans because it's often cheaper than belt-driven fans (think transverse engines). As far as running after the engine is shut off, the engine block (hence water) will continue to heat after it's shut down (as the pistons cool).

If it weren't for the fans, engines would overheat in any mode. I had one overheat at when it was -20F and I was cruising at 70MPH, after the belt broke.

The efficiency of the engines should be similar so heat out ~ mechanical power out. Of course, moving 3000# takes ten times the energy of 300# (at least on the first order) so will require 1ox the cooling.

[J. Clarke]

But was that because the fan stopped or because the water pump stopped?

[krw]

You're right. The water pump stopped as well.

[Leon]

You know what I am talking about. And if you want to get pin point specific the source is the fire/ explosion in the cylinder. The air eventually goes under the vehicle after hitting the engine.

Which is true 99.9999 percent of the time but gas caps get left off, and air does get in. At some time or another the right moisture and situation happens. I have to suspect that the motor has a check valve that prevents reverse flow of fuel/ vapor back through the sock filter and tank.

[Leon]

I don,' believe so. The fan is there to move air through the radiator when the vehicle is not moving fast enough help the radiator cast off heat.

You very likely had more going on to cause your engine to over heat, especially at -20. 30 or do years ago we had a brutal winter, at least for Houston. My service advisors were writing up an abnormally large number of over heating vehicles. We had temps that never came above freezing for days on end. And that was with fans working perfectly fine. The simple problem was that those vehicles antifreeze was not up to the task and the water/ antifreeze/ coolant mixture simply froze. There was no water circulating at all to cool the engines. With -20 degrees and the very likely fact that your fan belt also turned the water pump you probably had no water circulation between the radiator and engine and or your water froze. Unless you had a strong tail wind and the 70 mph vehicle wind speed was effectively reduced to very little, you should have had enough air passing through the radiator. Fans do not move air through the radiator any where near 70. Mph. It as very likely that the water pomp stopped turning fast enough to properly circulate the cooling system antifreeze/ coolant.

[Leon]

I think the large grills looked great on the early 70's Camaro z28s with split chrome bumpers.

[J. Clarke]

It wasn't really all that large by the standards of the time. I am conflicted about that model Camaro. When it first came out it was stunning, but to my eyes it hasn't aged all that well. Still, 70-73 models looked a lot better than the later ones with the rubber baby buggy bumpers.

[Leon]

Agreed! Even considering the new retro Camaros none have had the design appeal as the 70-73 models. Rubber bumpers have always looked like the loosing result of a compromise.

I think the most vulgar compromise was the first attempts in 74 to replace the chrome bumpers with the lethargic play dough inspired front ends of the Malibu. I was absolutely clueless why a single 74 Malibu ever moved off of the dealers lot. But thinking back there are people that bought the Citreon and Pontiac Aztec.

[John McCoy]

krw wrote in news:cs48raldrqu1fnjn8lmnl2qbb8eqrkb6f9@

4ax.com:

Not only that, but as Leon pointed out, the fan only needs to run when the car is stationary, or close to it. Using an electric fan means it can be turned off when not needed, which slightly reduces aero drag, and slightly reduces the power the engine has to supply to the altenator, both of which slightly increase fuel mileage.

Years ago NASCAR stock cars (which were required by rule to use belt driven fans) used to be fitted with tiny little fans barely larger than your hand, to reduce drag and engine load at 150mph+. As a consequence, it wasn't uncommon for cars to overheat when running slow due to a caution period.

John

[krw]

Nope. The antifreeze was good. J. Clarke nailed it. The fan belt broke so there was no water pump, either. I know the block wasn't frozen. The heat was full blast! ;-)