Hi
Going to make a medium sized wooden gate. I plan to make a simple butt joined frame for the gate itself, and top it with a strip of triangular timber about twice the width to shed water. I want to fit a bunch of small timber to fill the empty space, but not sure what would be the best way to fix it, and any other hints on idealising the details would be welcome. It'll be a full height job, and security isnt critical.
cheers, NT
On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:28:05 -0700 (PDT), NT had this to say:
It would really help if you could define "medium sized", "small timber" and "full height".
"security isnt critical" - does that mean it's purely ornamental?
Butt jointed sounds like a rather weak construction for any sort of gate...
Lap jointed, or mortice and tenon would give a much stiffer result.
If you are going to infill the space, would it not be simpler to do a ledge and brace type of construction (i.e. top middle and bottom rails, with a couple of diagonal braces, and then planks nailed/screwed to one side of them)?
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Sorry :) It'll be about 6'-7' high and 2'6"-3' wide. The small infill will be an open pattern of something like 1x1 to 1.5x1.5 timber.
Re security, it wont provide much, but some casual deterrent value is useful.
NT
You dont think those would compromise rot resistance somewhat? The gate will never be painted.
I would think butt jointed 2x4 would be stiff enough, different matter if it were just 2x2.
The style really wouldnt fit here. The gate needs to be seethrough, and something relatively modern.
NT
You don't say how you are making the butt joints. Dowel? Biscuit? Metal brackets? If you don't want to make mortise and tenon joints then cross-halvings are reasonably quick using a circular saw.
You need diagonal bracing to stop your rectangular structure turning into a parallelogram.
I have some picket fences with gates in the same style. A bit like the ledge and brace shown above, but with alternate verticals missing. You get some stiffening from screwed and glued lap joints between the verticals and horizontals, but I'd still include a diagonal brace.
My brother made me a gate for my 40th - standard Z and uprights frame shape with jigsawed cutouts top and bottom in exterior MDF to give a kind of 'grass and trees' top and bottom.
Has lasted 10 years so far.
I want it to last so the less holing the better. Probably just 6" screws through the ends.
with 2x4? I'm not convinced I do if the joints are tight. One thing's for sure though, I don't want the appearance of a big angled bracing plank. If there's any bracing it'll be small corner pieces.
The remaining question is how to attach the 1x1 infill. Perhaps just PU glue, that way there are no holes to rot. Maybe some pins too.
thanks, NT
With respect, it isn't really a joint if you are relying on "bite" from screws going along the grain, even if it is glued as well. Or do you mean screws at an angle going back into the outer timber, i.e. going partly across the grain. The nearest you will see commercially to your type of joint is the "pine bed frame" construction where the machine screw going along the grain goes into the side of a metal cylinder going across the timber.
6" screws in a 2 x 4 frame would be fine for say a window frame. or even a deck frame. They however don't ever move & a gate does. Small corner braces won't do the job. The side opposite the hinges will drop & the gate won't close/open properly.
The large diagonal braces are there to stop the rectangle becoming a parallelogram .
Cheers. Maybe I'd best re-examine the existing gate then, I thought it was 2x3 frame with no bracing whatever, and there was no troublesome distortion until it eventually rotted & fell apart.
Will report back.
NT
:
OK, the existing one is a 2x3 frame lap jointed with 4 nails in each corner, no added bracing, and it was fine until rotted.
I guess I'd better do likewise then, with 2x4. Thanks,
NT
Yup, a lap joint is *much* stronger than butt without any additional bracing.
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