I buy the Finish tablets from Costco for other parts of the family.
IME, they usually have one or two types of the Finish tablets in
store, but exactly which these are from the Finish range varies.
They also very frequently have one of them on offer.
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
I would say most machines last longer than 10 years (IME), but
most machines will need some repairs in that period. If you
can DIY repair them (I do across the extended family), that
probably makes an enormous difference to the economics of the
machine (cost of parts alone is usually a tiny fraction of the
cost of a callout plus heavily marked-up parts, and often no
parts are needed for a repair).
This will depend heavily on how someone does handwashing, but I believe
in most comparative tests, people use vastly more hot water hand washing
than a dishwasher uses in a cycle.
You haven't taken into account the procrastination time...
I strongly suspect (but haven't actually bothered to work it out), that
using tablets is probably significantly more expensive than using powder
or liquid detergent, rinse-aid, and salt. In particular, tabs are sized
to clean a full load, whereas with liquid or powder detergents, you can
dose according to load size and grease. If you have a smaller model
machine, the tabs will be even more oversized.
The other thing is that dishwasher liquid/powder detergent can be a
useful thing to have around for cleaning other things - it's fantastic
and incredibly quick (takes seconds) to clean even the mankiest of
stainless steel sinks, hobs, etc. Need to be aware it can give you
chemical burns though - not to be used in contact with your skin.
In the context of detergents, need to include a warning about children
getting access to any sort of dishwasher detergent. However, one in
particular is suddenly generating increasing A&E admissions, and that's
the liquid pouches, which unfortunately look a bit like sweets, and
have a great texture to chew on, until it bursts in your mouth. Child
then ends up with a tube down their airway for a week until the swelling
goes down, and in some cases operations have been required to reconstruct
the throat. As yet, no one has died in this country, but it's probably
just a matter of time before someone takes too long to get to A&E with
a swolen blocked airway.
softens it temporarily, then wiping with a copper scourer. Remove from
dishwasher at the end of the wash cycle while its still hot, not after the full
cycle is finished.
wash programs. Egg needs to be cold washed to avoid it setting, and programs
designed for oven dishes [[heat]] up right away.
over many washes. OK for a one off wash of tools, or for low value disposable
goods such as cooking spatulas.
of electrical goods and parts can be dishwashed. However its essential to choose
correctly which can and can't, and also necessary to use a safe drying
procedure, which isn't as simple as leave till touch dry.
same job as the salt in the salt reservoir (ie to refresh the ion exchanger).
The salt reservoir still needs to be filled.
[Needs something here about diagnosing a wash cycle which hasn't worked
due to machine fault. For starters...]
* Spin spray arm by hand to make sure nothing is interfering with it.
* You can check they rotate in operation by opening the door a few times
and noticing that they have changed position. If they rotate freely
by hand but not when the machine operates, check the angled jets
which propel the arm for blockage.
* If a spray arm is attached to and comes out with the wire rack,
check the spray arm water connection. Sometimes it's a plug-in
seal which fails, sometimes it's a jet into a cone, which might
get blocked by something badly placed in the wire rack.
* Leaving dirty things in the dishwasher too long before washing
makes them harder to clean. In the case of a large dishwasher
for one person, you may need to run it more frequently than you
can fill it up. If dirty plates/cutlary actually goes moldy
whilst waiting to be washed, the moldy areas sometimes won't
clean properly, and you should be running the machine more often.
A couple of drips will do. A squirt will generate foaming inside which
stops the dishwasher working, and may even cause foam to spill out and/or
trigger internal leak detector shutdown. It's also difficult to rinse out
the foam and a standard dishwasher rinse cycle isn't designed to do so.
delaying its release into the wash [[water]] until the main wash cycle, as the
initial rinse is cold. Ways to do this include:
use a wax insert under the cap to open only when hot. But the cost is several
times as much.
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
plus other links here
On Saturday, September 8, 2012 9:39:53 AM UTC+1, (unknown) wrote:
This applies to domestic '''dishwashers'''. Catering machines are quite different.
* A £300 machine lasting 10yrs = £30/yr = 57p a week.
* [[Electricity]] use is comparable to power use for handwash water [[heating]], so is not an added cost
* [[Detergent]] tabs 7.5p a wash
* salt £1.30/yr = 2.5p/week
2 machine washes a week = 57+15+2.5 = 84.5p
If we estimate 12 minutes a day handwashing, that's 84 mins a week.
Thus each hour of handwashing avoided costs '''60p'''. Working for 60p an hour seems to be popular.
[[Water]] use is typically less than hand washing dishes.
Baked on grease can be removed from wire oven shelves by dishwashing, which softens it temporarily, then wiping with a copper scourer. Remove from dishwasher at the end of the wash cycle while its still hot, not after the full cycle is finished.
Baked on grease is mostly not removed from non-stick goods, but regular washing can at least slow down its formation.
Egg and egg mixes can cook and stick on rather than [[clean]] off with some wash programs. Egg needs to be cold washed to avoid it setting, and programs designed for oven dishes [[heat]] up right away.
[[Wood]]en items can be dishwashed, but the wood surface slowly deteriorates over many washes. OK for a one off wash of tools, or for low value disposable goods such as cooking spatulas.
Cleaning many diy items
Goods can be descaled in a dishwasher by putting citric acid in the detergent dispenser instead of [[detergent]].
Despite the usual advice to never mix [[electricity]] and water, a wide range of electrical goods and parts can be dishwashed. However its essential to choose correctly which can and can't, and also necessary to use a safe drying procedure, which isn't as simple as leave till touch dry.
This should not be attempted by anyone without the necessary [[electrical]] expertise to do it [[safe]]ly.
The art of dishwasher cooking has a small cult following. Care is necessary to avoid washwater & detergent contamination.
===Not able to===
Dishwashers do '''not''' sterilise items.
One use we can't really recommend is cleaning the toilet seat by putting it in with the dishes. Apparently this was actually done in one US restaurant. Yum.
A small percentage of glassware slowly gets etched, going cloudy. Some lead glass is vulnerable, some isn't. Is caused by the hot alkali, and there's no remedy other than not dishwashing it, to avoid the cloudy area growing.
Its also possible to get hard water desposits on glass if salt & rinse aid aren't used. These come off with vinegar.
The author has used various brands of detergent tablets from cheapo to expensive brands, and has never found any difference in the end result.
Separate detergent and rinse aid is cheaper than the more expensive brands of detergent tablets.
Dishwasher detergent is also very good at cleaning hobs, sinks etc. Use it with hot water and avoid skin contact, it can cause chemical burns.
All in one tablets contain salt, but its not used in the machine to do the same job as the salt in the salt reservoir (ie to refresh the ion exchanger). The salt reservoir still needs to be filled, unless your water is very soft.
Only use dishwasher salt. Other grades are much too impure, and stop the ion exchanger working, causing scaling & water spotting.
One uk.d-i-yer says his machine cleans fine with no salt or rinse aid.
* Unblock spray arm jets & check they rotate ok
* [[Acid]] clean the machine
* Ensure the machine has salt in the reservoir
* Clean filters
==When it doesn't clean==
When a dishwasher doesn't clean stuff off, the following can be used:
* An overnight soak in water before dishwashing removes a lot of muck
* A 2 day soak in bleach removes more resistant muck
* Cleaning ceramics, glass & plastics with hydrochloric [[acid]] removes just about everything else, including rust marks
* Vinegar soaking removes a fair range of muck films on stainless steel pans
* Spots of rust & muck on steel can be removed with a copper scourer or a brass brush in a [[die grinder]].
==Cleaning the dishwasher==
Proteins form a gloop that accummulates in some hidden parts of the machine, causing smells, bacterial & [[mould]] growth and sometimes machine failure.
Ordinary washing up liquid removes muck dishwasher [[detergent]] doesn't. A few drips of it in the machine before starting avoids buildup. Don't overdo it.
Acetic & citric [[acid]]s tackle both protein gloop and [[limescale]]. These need to be used without the usual [[detergent]], which is [[alkali]]ne.
They are far more effective used hot than cold. For it to work hot requires delaying its release into the wash [[water]] until the main wash cycle, as the initial rinse is cold. Ways to do this include:
*putting [[acid]] powder in the [[detergent]] drawer
*or using a commercial delayed release dishwasher [[clean]]er bottle. These use a wax insert under the cap to open only when hot. But the cost is several times as much.
Dishwasher detergents are alkaline, and need to be kept well away from young children and animals.
Liquid pouches in particular have caused A&E admissions. They look a bit like sweets, and have a great texture to chew on, until it bursts in the mouth. Child then ends up with a tube down their airway for a week until the swelling goes down, and in some cases operations have been required to reconstruct the throat.
==Smell & mould==
Closing the door for days on end with dirty dishes inside causes mould & smells. Leave the door ajar and this doesn't normally happen, the air circulation plus drying prevent it.
On Sep 8, 9:39 am, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
Surely they don't. The ones I've seen mention 'salt effect', in other
words they contain some water-softening ingredient which is supposed
to reduce or eliminate the need for salt to regenerate the ion-
exchange resin. But I would have thought NaCl itself was an entirely
It beats me why you bother, 5 mins each night, by hand, and it's done.
Why TF do you need/want dishwashers?
When I was a kid..............and still had change from a farthing.
The two domestic chores I hate most are dishwashing and ironing.
Neither gets done. The machine only gets run when it's full, the most
economical way of doing it, and if it needs ironing, I don't wear it.
Getting the stuff out of the washing machine as soon as it's finished
and hanging it up carefully to dry removes the need to iron most things.
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