What is it with Vaillant?

A while back I went to look at a Vaillant that was giving its user problems. User didn't have a manual for it and neither did I so I phone Vaillant and pressed the appropriate buttons for their literature department. Couldn't get through to a human but left a message requesting a manual for the particular model, prefereably electronically and was there somewhere I could get PDFs of all their manuals for when I go to a customer so I can actually do something useful for them at the time? Some weeks later I got a bundle of glossy brochures for the model I was after and some others - no servicing instructions.

Later I phoned tech support to ask about the particular problem. Took 10 or 15 minutes of being told how important my call was to them and how they were doing their "utmost" to help - utmost except for actually having enough staff on to answer it.

More recently phoned tech support about another of their boilers, which had condensate dripping out of the heat exchanger and seemed to have a problem with its condensate syphon not getting rid of condensate quickly enough. Asked specifically if the syphon was supposed to fill up and then dump condensate out quickly (which is what Worcester Bosch ones I'm familiar with do) rather than dribble it out, which this one seemed to be doing. After almost 10 minutes of being told how important my call was to them, againg, finally got through to someone who assured me that it should dump condensate rapidly. I pointed out that the holes feeding the condensate output spout were rather narrow, but assured that it should dump rapidly and if it wasn't doing so, time for a new one. None at local stockist so ordered on t'interweb and got new, improved design model condensate syphon today. Tried it out: filled it up and it .... dribbled out. It actually dribbles out more slowly than I've seen condensate coming out of the heat exchanger while I was running the machine into a bowl instead of the syphon, during the v. cold weather last week. No wonder the sodding thing's backing up into the HX!

And now I've got a customer I put a Vaillant in for* last May who's having problem with teh machine making howling noises from within while it's running. Suggested he contact Vaillant since it's surely under warranty. He did and what did they do? "Sorry to hear it sir, our machines shouldn't do things like that, we'll be round pronto to fix it." Did they bollox? They gave hime some old tosh about getting a receipt for proof of purchase from me (i.e. my receipt when I bought it). (Like, if he'd had British Gas install it, they'd give him a copy of their purchase invoice?!). And warned him that if it was "installer error" they'd charge for it.

  • I only installed a Vaillant rather than a W-B at his insistence: apparently Vaillant are a more ethical company. (Why is it that ethical and competent don't seem to go together?) I'm sticking to W-B from now on. Their tech support aren't 100% (e.g. there's an arcane problem regarding their Ri series (at least) with Honeywell-pattern Y-plan valves, which I only got a correct solution for at third attempt) but they have stretched their normal 2-year warranty to look at a seeming boiler problem a few weeks outside the nominal warranty period, and have generally answered the phone promptly and been reasonably clueful.
Reply to
YAPH
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YAPH gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

I have no idea about Vaillant, but I struggle to see how they could be a more "ethical" company than Bosch - who are almost entirely owned by a humanitarian & development charity.

Reply to
Adrian

Vailant's head office is about 2 miles from me - I could go and taunt them for you if you like :-)

My mate Graham Baron used to be a service engineer for them & is now self employed as a service agent/installer.

From conversations with him in the past, they don't like 'non Vailant' people much, so it could be a deliberate policy.

His deal with them seemed to be that he didn't install or work on any other make and they wouldn't appoint any other 'official' service agents locally. Having said that, their site lists 15 local installers (he is listed twice though), so maybe thats changed since I last spoke to him - haven't seen him for a while.

Or maybe they are 14 ex Valient people?

Reply to
The Medway Handyman

I sent them an email and had a reply by phone the next day with very helpful advice.

Rob

Reply to
Rob

Some of their installation/user manuals and servicing bumf seem to be available online (as I was browsing with a view to maybe, in the summer, just possibly --- urrrr, paying someone to replace the boiler). But they weren't easy to find. So for once perhaps I can give a little bit back with an example of the power of Google's advance search facility. Try entering into Google's search box:

installation instructions filetype:pdf site:vaillant.co.uk

That gives links to Ecotec Plus, uniStor and a few others

plus servicing instns and spares lists such as

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Reply to
neverwas

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Thanks for that - I had to use Google until I realised that Yahoo (which I prefer) didn't like some of the terms, so tried Yahoo with just the essential words and found this:

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's gotoplumbing and has pages of links for Vaillant boilers - I don't know how good they are as I've not yet found my model (it's about 10yo).

Reply to
PeterC

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SODDIT! - sorry, the site charges for access to anything useful.

Reply to
PeterC

What charity is that?

Reply to
YAPH

Robert Bosch Foundation (Robert Bosch Stiftung GmbH)

Reply to
neverwas

I have heard this is due to the customer service side of things being taken over by Glow-worm in Belper.

Reply to
David

IIRC from "Ethical Consumer" magazine, Bosch is involved in the arms trade or military projects. However, I'm not very impressed with EC magazine as they do not rate the functionality or longevity of the products they review.

"Which" has become a comic, so I've gone back to choosing based on my and friends' experiences. Thus I've recently replaced my over 20 year old Vaillant with another Vaillant*.

*Frankly, despite it being quiet and probably highly efficient, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone as the electronic controller is a nightmare to program.
Reply to
Jan Wysocki

You didn't have to get the Vaillant controller.

Reply to
David

[snip, Vaillant discussion]

So I see. That wasn't clear to me when I had it installed. Thanks to the URLs posted by neverwas, I now know how to connect an external controller to my Vaillant. A Wickes controller, for example, is a lot easier to program!

Why is it that nobody produces a little touchscreen controller with a simple "touch the 15 minute blocks that you want the heating on for" interface? I was also excited to see that Vaillant offer a GSM/GPRS interface. How wonderful I thought, I can just send my boiler a text to tell it I'm late and to delay ignition for 2 hours. Unfortunately it's nothing of the sort*. (I know I could set up a computer to do all of the above, but sometimes life's too short.)

*
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Reply to
Jan Wysocki

Could you taunt them with your foot please Dave? :-)

Today, having taken apart the boiler of one of my Vaillant-victim customers to try to find out why it was leaking condensate despite having an effective condensate drain, I eventually discovered that it was leaking from the back where the heat exchanger meets the flue manifold. Seems to be sealed (or in this case, not) by a rubber washer between the two and replacement (once I've got the part, $DEITY knows how much it'll cost) will require draining down much of the system (since Vaillant helpfully don't fit isolation valves to flow and return) and stripping down most of the boiler. And dismantling & replacing this part isn't described in the manual so back on the dog to Vaillant tech support for advice.

Over 40 minutes I spent waiting. 40 BLOODY MINUTES!!! All the time being reminded how important my call was to them and how they were doing their "utmost" to answer it. And then I gave up and tried another number. Eventually bent the ear of an unfortunate phone droid enough to get put through to someone technical, who turned out to be at Glow-worm. Seems that Vaillant and Glow-worm, like the old British Leyland (in more ways than one!), have the same product, different badges. Mr Worm described how to do the replacement and gave me a part number (again, helpfully not mentioned in the poxy installation manual) for G-W's version of the part, which I'm hoping will be OK for the Vaillant.

Or maybe I'll just save the customers time & money and fit them a W-B ;-)

Reply to
YAPH

My EcoTEC Pro 28 has them, they are turned with a hex or some such (I just tried bits from my set until one fitted, I can't remember which one).

Reply to
Cod Roe

My glowworm complheat has them, but the first time they were needed the stem snapped off one one, and the other started leaking. They've been supplanted by a pair of full bore valves just above the boiler. These will prove invaluable when I replace it.

Reply to
<me9

Wysocki

you have?

Reply to
David

Wysocki

The digital controller that fits in the front panel of the boiler.

Reply to
Jan Wysocki

Wysocki

Is this the weather compensated controller?

It could be a Timeswitch 140,VRC400 or a VRC430.

Reply to
David

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