This wasn't diy, it was a £10 million refurb that took building
regs into account and the cladding might not have been a problem
if the insulation had been rockwool instead of 'fire resistant'
celotex. All manner of 'experts' were happy with this work.
It was an unfortunate combination of events that caused this fire
and I suspect the worst mistake was allowing the stairwell to
become full of smoke. The enquiry will reveal all.
If someone is competent to work on water, what makes you say the
principles for gas are any different? The outcome of faulty work may well
be - but that's a different argument.
Would you be quite happy if a pro plumber installed pipework that leaked,
but only unhappy if it happened with gas?
*Marathon runners with bad footwear suffer the agony of defeat*
Dave Plowman email@example.com London SW
The plumbing aspect is one part of it, but there is obviously more to be
aware of. Accidents with the gas side of things are very rare, but
problems with CO poisoning are more common. So understanding the
requirements for flue placement and assembly, adequate ventilation etc
are equally important. Also worth noting that someone skilled in
plumbing will generally be able to tackle most plumbing jobs, but gas
skills are slightly more modular - so being competent to install a
boiler does not imply you are aware of the specific requirements for an
unflued device like a hob for example.
Thought it was perfectly 'legal' for anyone to connect a gas cooker to the
plug in type connector. Are the requirements of a hob only somehow
different? Although I do know the plug in type of connector isn't allowed
for a fixed hob.
*A closed mouth gathers no feet.
Dave Plowman firstname.lastname@example.org London SW
I have seen a number of discussions revolving around BS 6172 which say
that either Fixed or Flexible connection can be made to hobs, unless the
Manufacturer's Instructions say Rigid only.
The are further conditions that the flexible pipe must not be in contact
with a surface >70C or is likely to be chafed, as in by a drawer.
There are for example minimum room volume requirements, and a minimum
size of ventilation required. I presume (I have not checked) these also
apply to free standing cookers, and the onus would be on the installer
of the bayonet connection point to ensure they are met in any room they
install the point in.
It is, but its a common belief that its not, based on historic guidance
in BS 6172.
The 1982 version said: "Built-in ovens, drop-in hotplates and other
individual units should be connected to the installation pipe by means
of rigid or semi-rigid gas connections. Appliance flexible connections
of the type used with gas cookers are not appropriate for these
appliances since they are not intended to be movable by the customer.
The gas connection pipe size should be not less than that of the inlet
connections of the appliance."
The 2004 version of the BS 6172 doc probably (I don't have a pre
amendment version to check) originally had similar wording, but was
amended to have the same words as now shown in the 2010 version:
"11.1.3 A gas hob shall be connected to the termination point by means
of rigid pipework or, unless stated otherwise in the manufacturer's
instructions, a flexible connector and self-sealing plug-in device
conforming to BS 669-1."
Not necessarily. We are assuming the pressure is OK at the meter. The
test is to ensure it does not drop at the boiler end when it is on full
power. If it does it is more likely to be inadequate pipework in the
house than a supply fault. But if properly designed it is just a check
to show it works and is not blocked anywhere.
On Wed, 27 Dec 2017 14:13:07 +0000, Paul Giverin wrote:
Cynical of me, but I think the incentives to buy a Baxi may be because
they are not a market leader (possibly for reasons).
We fitted a WB combi in 2005-2006 and last I heard it is still going
strong with no problems. This was condensing IIRC, with the condensate
pipe feeding into the back of the upstairs toilet. Similar age to yours as
far as I can tell.
Daughter fitted a Baxi a couple of years later because her local plumber
supplied and serviced them and it crapped out big time and has since been
replaced. Silly girl didn't have it serviced annually so didn't get a
warranty claim. Having said that we didn't have the WB serviced annually
and didn't need to claim on warranty. From my very limited experience
boiler installers tend to specialise in one model because it is easiest to
just learn one system and carry one set of spares. So the "preferred
supplier" is often the one most convenient for the installer.
Are you sure the 28 CDi is non-condensing? My GoogleFu isn't working
particularly well but I thought that range had been condensing from at
least the turn of the century.
Anyway, I would expect the boiler to have a decent life left in it, but if
it is really getting long in the tooth then a 12 year record of reasonable
service with at least another 2 years life (14 years+) seems to me to be
more of a recommendation than a 10 year warranty.
On that basis of personal bias if I were going to replace the boiler (on
the basis that if I ran it until it failed I might not then be able to
afford to replace it) I would be tempted to replace like with like.
Cheapest is not always best, neither is a bargain always one. BTDTBTS.
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64
And stay away from Alphas...
I've just put a WB 42 CDi in and I'm pretty pleased with it.
It's not the most sophisticated (no pump speed control, no weather
compensation unless you sell your soul to their internet all in one system).
But it is competent, stable, very powerful (the 42kW is the hot water -
I have used flow restrictor valves to the bath and given that half the
theoretical winter output of DHW which still fills the bath in 15 mins
or so). The idea is that when I have the shower room done, that can run
and the bath can fill at the same time.
I'm told by the plumbers that WB have good parts availability when it
My other option was a Viessmann - but they said there can be a lag on
getting parts (like days to a week rather than mostly off the shelf like
WB). However, the Viessmann boilers are better built (stainless heat
exchanger) and weather comp is "add a sensor". Downsides apart from the
alleged parts availability is the cost and the lack of a model than can
match the 42CDi for DHW.
I should add, in my case, this was a whole new system - so I could over
spec the rads to run easily within the condensing range. Most of the
year, I can run with 55/45C flow/return which is pretty cool. Right now
I have it set to about 64/54C which gives a fast heat up on a cold day
and still in condensing mode.
I've just checked and I've got a Baxi in my cupboard.
It's just coming up to 9 years old, never given me a problem (and I think
that girly who owned it before me never once had it serviced)
I wouldn't even consider changing it at 10 years old
Boilers don't need "servicing" they only need attention when they stop
working. Not having some half-wit poking and twiddling stuff that
doesn't need either action is the the best way to ensure boiler longevity.
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