Can someone explan how the Council commisioned inspection works?
If I have put a new kitchin in which involved moving a few socked and connecting up the new cooker i would be falling foul of PartP - How and when is it inspected? I presume it can't be when its finished as you will not be able to see behind the cosmetics to see how the damage is done.
You ought to have submitted a building notice to them before starting.
Some minor electrical work is exempt from the full rigmarole, but nothing in a kitchen is, so the two alternatives would have been to employ an electrician who is a member of one of the designated electrical contracting mediaeval guilds and who can therefore self certify his work, or to go for the building notice with building control at the local authority.
Your options now are:
- Do the building notice, which will now be in the form of a regularisation. This could be nasty because the ensuing inspection of the wiring could involve a jobsworth. While it is possible to do some tests with instruments, there should be visual checks at first fix (i.e. before plaster and tiles) that cables run in the right places. There are requirements in the wiring regulations for them only to run horizontally or vertically between sockets and switches or in a band 150mm from a corner or top of a wall. A forgiving inspector might let that go. One that is less so would not sign it off without seeing it.
- Do nothing for the moment. Nobody from the council is going to come round. They don't have detector vans. However, if you sell, or possibly renew buildings insurance, you will/may be asked about works in the house and perhaps specifically about wiring. If the project started or "started" before the end of 2004, then you can legitimately, or according to your conscience say no because part P didn't apply on commencement. On the other hand, if there were a fire or somebody was electrocuted because you had done something wrong, then there could be unfortunate consequences.
The council do not check, they get someone else to check and charge you the cost of the submission and the check. The councils had adequate warning of what was to happen and 99% of them did nothing. So, it is best to have a self certified electrician to check it out and sign it off.
If you do it and don't tell, then how would they know? Difficult. When selling a house then you get it all checked out which gives you selling edge.
The "unfortunate consequences" have always been there.
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The first option is what I am looking to do. My local council charges £60+ VAT for the inspection which will be carried out by a 3rd party who is certified. Its this process I was wondering about. Looks like no-one has actually got this to happen yet.
The second option is not really there as I am just purchasing the house so its obvious if i did it it would be after 2004
So, it is best to have a
So they could sign it off rather than the council commisioned place even if I did the work.
Appears so. As long as you don't switch on the power and the tester does that then you can do what the hell you like anywhere. If there is parts that need inspecting, but you have tiled over, take a digital photo of the work with time stamp.
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not necessarily - unless it's a new house there is unlikely to be any form of wiring diagram. So the kitchen was changed.,.. "don't think the wiring was touched, guv". But the accessories all have 2005 date stamps on them, "yes, the accessories were changed - the old ones were decidedly grubby." This is outwith the scope of Part P, AIUI.
And, at sale time "Don't know" is a perfectly legitimate answer...
Is that all they charge? No Building notice fee then the £60 on top?
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This is not an option.
The two choices, if the work is not exempt as a minor work are:
- Use a contractor who is a member of one of the approved organisations to do the work and self certify it.
- Do the work yourself and submit a building notice.
The second of these triggers an inspection.
This is always an option, but does not get past a question in a vendor's solicitor's questionnaire about work subject to building control having been done. At that stage it would be a case of telling lies or getting the application regularised.
No they can't unless they are willing to falsify that they did the work.
If you look at the flow chart
I don't think that getting a contractor in and asking only for an inspection is a realistic option. They are supposed to have done the work if they self certify it. At best, you would get a certificate, but there is the risk anyway that any electrician inspecting will have an issue with the cables now being hidden.
To get the paperwork coverage, you really need to have the building notice or the invoice from the work having been done by an approved contractor.
Is this all unnecessary bureaucratic nonsense? Yes.
Are you likely to get caught? No.
Could you run into problems when selling? Possibly.
At the least, you might have to do a regularisation exercise with the council. I am sure that this will happen a lot, and you could simply plead ignorance at that point.
Provided you didn't falsify statements for conveyancing I am sure that a council, given the situation of the legislation being recent, would just take your money (which is very little more for regularising vs. original notice), organise an inspection (perhaps) and issue the paperwork.
The only other problem is if an application for building insurance had similar questions. Then you have a moral question about what you want to say.
Unfortunately, the thing you can't easily undo is the wiring being plastered and tiled over.
So it seems to me that the choices are between doing nothing and perhaps delaying a future sale through having to clean up required paperwork and risking whatever outcome through going the building notice route.
On balance, I think I'd address it now, but it is a bit devil and deep blue sea.
Ah just double checked on
It'd be a lot of money to pay if all you wanted to do was stay on the right side of the law and add a couple of extra sockets to the kitchen!
Obviously far safer, legal and cheaper just to keep using that 4 way extension cable, next to the sink..... ;-)
Strange
Works for me.
Try this one instead.
You're making things up.
Where is the basis for that suggestion in the legislation or the published guidelines?
If you install your own ring and run it back to the CU and don't connect to the mcb, get an electrician to connect at the CU, he then has done work on the wiring, test, inspect and sign off then a that is totally within the law, even if it is in wet areas. The DIYer did not have energy at sockets or any other point which could have endangered life. Everything he did was cold.
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In the kitchen, if you had MDF as the tile back above the worktops and leave a cable space behind, insert sockets and run flex down into the space under the units and have each socket plugged into an extension, then would this be legal? Just like having a 4 or 6 way extension in the kitchen.
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What evidence would there be that it wasn't done (or started..) by the previous owner ?
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