Given there is actual measurement involved in making the labels:
For every letter on the wet grip test is 3m stopping distance, for example.
Theo
And that's the thing. 'Logically' one (interested in such things) would go for the cheapest tyre that scored as high as possible on all the points you consider 'important'. I look upon it like this:
Most tyres will do what they need in the dry.
Some tyres will do similar in the dry.
Few will do well in the snow / mud.
None (without studs) will do very well on black ice.
So, the most realistic test is if a tyre might save you when really pushed and a tyre that stops 2m short of another brand might be the difference from a change of underwear or a recovery truck on a motorway ... or worse.
At the same time, I'm not sure I could justify spending £100 over £75 / corner if the difference in stopping distance is only 20cm, especially if other characteristics (like wear or noise) are better.
Cheers, T i m
They are the ones that came fitted on the Rover. ;-(
Yes, I'm sure they are from a basic 'functionality' POV but I'm guessing they fit different tyres to a shopping trolley than to an F1 car. ;-)
And that was my point ... the chances are you *can* get budget / unknown brand tyres that either 'just happen' to be made out of the same compounds in the same factory as the known brand tyres, but how would you ever find out, short of doing a tyre comparison test?
Quite (depending on 'why' etc).
'Some people' just want their tyres to last as long as possible because they bimble up and down the motorway and rarely ever test to tyres to their limits. If they did, they may find their limits aren't a good as the car in front ... ;-( [1]
Cheers, T i m
[1] I was going round the M25 in the Sierra estate and had just overtaken a string of cars in lanes 1 and two and was following a Porsche Boxter. A Police motorway patrol was in front in lane 1 and indicating for people to keep out of lane 1 / 2 as they had some debris in the (bit's of lorry tyre). The Porsche thought the cop wanted him to stop, and he did, from 70 mph with he multi potted calipers all round and I nearly found myself in his engine compartment. The Policeman gave him a right bollocking for driving so dangerously.
More importantly from my POV is if the vehicle and it's contents 'last longer' (than they might have done if shod in something lesser)?
I would rather get fewer miles safer out of a tyre than the other way round (and given all this is compromise).
Cheers, T i m
Whilst that *could* be handy (and says something about how tyres really do matter, when the 'going gets tough'), we are hoping to have to test that one out. ;-)
Couldn't that depend in what was there before? eg, if the previous tyres had a wet grip rating of 75% and these 80%, would you ever notice?
Yes, that's where it can show up (if the tests are conducted properly) and in some cases the numbers are way different. Like an extra 'n' meters stopping distance could *easily* be the difference between easily stopping short and a very nasty crash.
Mate saw some standing water ahead and backed off to go though it 'gently' (50 mpg rather than 70). The bloke behind didn't see it, overtook, aquaplaned, spun round several times as my mate came to a gentle halt well short of him (smiling).
Cheers, T i m
Thanks (both).
Cheers, T i m
The Hakkapeliitta are still scoring good marks.
The anecdotal reports on the Blizzak years ago, was that they were "good the first year", and it was downhill from there. You'd dump them perhaps, before the tread was done.
And you want tires with the right speed rating. A couple decades ago, I had a bad habit of buying the "wobbly tires", until I figured out that maybe I needed to bump the speed grade. Then they stopped wobbling. It's not that you "plan to drive 180kmh", it's that you want a sidewall that isn't as weak as piss.
And for me, the best driving in winter is with a stick. If you're out on a national highway, start to lose it and drift over the line, just ease off on the accelerator and the control comes back. That's a little bit of engine braking. These BEVs need to be able to emulate that sort of behavior, to make them safer in winter.
With winter tires (especially with Blizzak), you want to go to a grocery store parking lot and practice your spinouts and slides. My previous car didn't have a lot in the way of traction control features, but, the car has predictable break-away behavior. And you need to calibrate in the parking lot, to get back the "feel". You can practice your "driving in the direction of the slide" and so on. Just make sure the parking lot you use, doesn't have light pilons in the center, and is edge lit, so you have plenty of room to practice.
Paul
Much better than the Bridgestone Potenza S001 fitted new. These Michelin Cross Climate tyres have a very good handling response in snow and ice.
Winter tires in Quebec province are mandatory. Not All Seasons, winter tires.
All seasons can be perfectly useless in winter. I've driven on all seasons, where on the highway, I could only do 80km before the car was fish-tailing, when the rest of the cars on the road were perfectly stable at
100km/hr. That's when I knew it was time to get a set of winters.And that's why they made it the law there, that everyone have winter tires on a certain date. I can tell you, a few of the cheaper citizens complained.
I've driving in Quebec, during a snow storm (in a bus on a ski trip), and seen cars off the road every
100 feet. Car after car after car. That's how treacherous the driving can be there. When we were driving by, the road conditions didn't seem to be that bad at the time. But it did leave an impression, seeing so many cars off the road like that. They have relatively good road maintenance, and have to switch over to sand, as salt stops working below -18C. I don't know if you've ever driven at night on roads that have received sand treatment - you can't tell where the edge of the road is, because everything is "brown".Other parts of the country, mountain driving has mandatory chains fitted. You can't take certain mountain roads in winter, without chains on. Usually on those roads, there's a checkpoint and a policeman, to keep everyone honest.
I keep two sets of rims. I keep all seasons on the car for summer driving. And winters on the second set of rims for winter. I have a floor jack and two jack stands, and twice a year, get out in the driveway and change them. I've even got the nice torque wrench, to torque them properly. Usually when I change them, the air temperature outside is 0C. The only thing that keeps me in the house, is if there's a 30MPH wind when it's 0C outside. I've changed tires before in the wind, where I'm beginning to shiver. The air temp is less of an issue. The wind can be a bitch.
You stop using winters, above around 7C. That's a rough rule of thumb.
Paul
Bottom line is how much you value the safety of the occupants. Basic risk assessment.
My experience of BEVs is limited but I can certainly turn the regenerative braking on lift-off off in my car. I think this feature is common.
Yep. I?m always amazed at the amount of panic induced amongst many drivers who have clearly never practiced driving in snow/ice. I learned to drive in Aberdeenshire and if you weren?t comfortable with driving in snow, you would spend a lot of time trapped at home.
Tim
In the days when you squandered the planet's resources on things like your family motorcycle tour of Scotland, did your bikes have budget, mid-range, or top-quality tyres?
The answer to that should give you a pointer to which way to go with your purchase.
Then, of course, back in September, you said this when talking about a possible future purchase:
"Now more people (inc me) are trying to avoid animal products wherever possible, do you think I might consider that aspect the next time I do buy tyres?" (posted 13/9/2020)
It would seem from your current comments that £sd is more important than principle.
Michelin cross climate every time for me. Not cheap but neither is my life.
Mike
Seems to be a pretty comprehensive test. Not sure going for a full snow tyre is required in our case as I'm not sure they would be the best in the wet?
If the road surface is clean, reasonably smooth and dry, then slicks offer the best grip. If it's wet you still need enough rubber to give grip but enough gap between the tread blocks to allow water out of the contact patch fast enough to prevent aquaplaning. For mud / snow you need the gaps big enough so that they self clear, or you are back to slicks again. ;-)
I guess that's a tricky one to simulate without a *very* sophisticated rig?
That's good.
Yeah, and that's the thing you don't find out till after you have spent your cash. ;-(
I think it's a legal requirement?
I think the logic is that it's not only about speed but the additional loads that something that could do speed 'N' could exert on the tyre, like acceleration and braking loads.
Like, a car bought and used here in the UK shouldn't normally go over
70mph so why would you need a tyre capable of 186mph (J)? <snip>Agreed, big time (and exactly what I did).
Yup. After owning / driving my RWD 2L Sierra Estate for 23 years I had a pretty good feel of how it handled in all conditions and you could easily play with the back end on a wet roundabout using the throttle. ;-)
That 'feel' (as you say) got us out of trouble when a car pulled out on us from a side turning and I 'threaded the needle'. ;-)
Quite, and otherwise empty (ideally). ;-)
Cheers, T i m
p.s. I has a Morris Minor van and took a mate out in the snow for some slip-sliding fun. when we got back to mine he took me out in is Ford Escort Mexico and we ended up on the pavement and close to someone's front wall. I had fairly narrow tyres on the van ... ;-)
Cheers Mike.
Quite. Assuming you are going to keep the car and intend using it on the public roads it really doesn't matter what the car is worth, as you say, it's what you value your (and other peoples) lives at.
(We know those buying huge vehicles because they are 'safer for them and their family' don't value other peoples lives much (those they want to be part of their crumple zone)). <ducks> ;-)
Cheers, T i m
Well that would probably happen *anyway* with the Yank Tank because:
1) It's not designed to go round corners ...and
2) Therefore doesn't have a diff (so something has to give). ;-)Cheers, T i m
Are you suggesting that any vehicles on the roads today have no differential or other means of allowing the two wheels on the same axis (*) to turn at different speeds for cornering? Do all 4WD vehicles have a differential between front and rear axles as well as one between each pair of wheels on the same axle?
(*) I say "axis" rather than "axle" to include non-driven wheels that are inline with each other but are not connected to each other.
<snip>
OK thanks jon.
Good to know, 'in case' etc.
Cheers, T i m
USA squealing tyre test ??
Suzuki SJ410 4WD only had a dog clutch to engage 4WD. Driving on a hard surface was then 'interesting'.
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.