OT - PC / Battery back-up question

HI Folks PC question - but, if possible, I'll be DIY-ing the repair..
At one time - the mains supply out here was a bit flaky, so I installed a 2nd-hand APC 1500 Smart-UPS. Since then, it's had two new sets of batteries, and has (generally) behaved itself - allowing long enough to shut down the Windows10 PC (left on 24/7) gracefully in the event of power cuts (assuming that you happen to be near the PC when the outage occurs).
The last few weeks, I've noticed that the PC seems to have rebooted itself while I've been away from it. Just now I watched as the UPS gave a 'clunk', dropped the power completely and then, after a few seconds, restarted itself - all the while indicating that the house mains was stable & present..
These power outages don't seem to upset Win10 at all - so I'm wondering if it's worth throwing another set of batteries at the UPS (the last set were installed Jan 2016 and cost 112 euro) - or just unplug the UPS and feed the PC with raw mains, and live with any consequences...
Back in the day, pulling the power on a Windows box without shutting it down properly used to be a recipe for disaster - though perhaps modern disks are more tolerant of this sort of abuse..?
Worth throwing another set of batteries at the thing - do you think? Comments / suggestions, please? Thanks, Adrian
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2018 08:13:44 +0000, Adrian Brentnall wrote:

I normally reckon on my UPS batteries lasting 3/4 years depending on the temperature where they are installed.
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The other thing to consider of course is that its not the ups but the PC which is having overheating issues and shutting down to protect itself. That also might explain why its not corrupted anything as some of the more recent ones do a controlled dump of memory before going down. Normally though they do not restart, they stay down or it would continually restart. Check all internal connections and plugs etc. Brian
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On 16/11/2018 10:13, Brian Gaff wrote:

Good thought - but, having watched it this morning, it's the UPS actually dropping its 'mains out' - as the LCD monitor also went off.
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On 16 Nov 2018 08:32:32 GMT, Bob Eager wrote:

last

Mar 14 for the last set here. After the previous set almost went into meltdown, what's that funny smell? Ouch the UPS is bloomin' hot!

with

Only you can answer that.

That's about what I was getting and APC UPS's are well known for cooking their batteries. After the near meltdown I got at mine, reduced the charge voltage(*), fitted a fan and disabled the self test. Result is the UPS sits at about 30 C instead of 40+ and the 4 1/2 year old batteries still hold up under load.
(*) Factory set it's too high for standby charging at room temp let alone at 40+ C. The higher the battery temp, the lower the charge voltage needs to be.
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On 16/11/2018 08:32, Bob Eager wrote:

Thanks Bob.... This one's sitting in an open cabinet, not anything fancy.... Just debating whether it's worth €40/year for the UPS facility - and not really confident that replacing the batteries will solve the problem.
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2018 14:17:34 +0000, Adrian Brentnall wrote:

I have them (I have three!) for the mains conditioning aspect. Although last week we *did* have a power cut of over an hour, and I was out. It was nice that all of the machines shut down correctly and then powered themselves off (seven of them in total).
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On 16/11/2018 14:39, Bob Eager wrote:

I never did manage to get the 'orderly shutdown' bit working with this UPS - seems it didn't want to talk to the PC.... So - in my case, I'm getting some power conditioning, and the chance to hot-foot it to the PC in the event of a mains failure so I can manually shut it down... - if I happen to be here & awake <g> Not really sure it's worth the cost & effort.
I used to do a lot of web-development (back when the mains was a bit iffy) - but don't do hardly any of that now, so there's not that much 'vital' work that's going on, and, of course, there are backups...
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2018 08:13:44 +0000, Adrian Brentnall

Maybe performing a self-test? I've got rack-mount APC UPSes that make a clunk when they perform a self-test. They don't drop the output power though.
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2018 08:45:08 +0000, Caecilius wrote:

I do the self test then measure the battery percentage after 5 mins recovery. If it's not 100%, the battery is on its way out.
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On 16/11/2018 09:54, Bob Eager wrote:

Good idea. My suspicion is that the self-test is what's killing it - maybe I'll shut the pc down gracefully later on and try pressing the self-test button to see what happens....
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On 16/11/2018 08:45, Caecilius wrote:

Yes - it does look like a self-test - I guess the result then is 'FAIL' <grin> Question is - will €120's worth of new batteries fix it.. I'm sure I remember reading somewhere that APC UPS's aren't kind to their batteries - something to do with over-charging them...? - and I think there was a modification to reduce the charging current - but don't really want to dive inside the thing, and, to be honest, I'm wondering if having a UPS is that big an issue...?
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Caecilius wrote:

They give a "clunk" when switching in/out of buck mode or boost mode, i.e. if your mains voltage gets too high or too low.
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On 16/11/2018 08:13, Adrian Brentnall wrote:

I don't have a UPS and windows recovers nicely from any power drops.
I would just add that this does not sound like a battery problem. Speaking out of ignorance, I would really really hope that a properly working UPS connected to the mains would never drop its output power like that, regardless of the state of the batteries.
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On 16/11/2018 09:07, GB wrote:

I agree.
I'd just add that, without UPS, all you should lose in the event of power failure should be the data inputted since the last save. If even that could be a problem, increase the autosave frequency!
Nick
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On 16/11/2018 09:18, Nick Odell wrote:

I no longer use a UPS but when I could get them s/h from work I did so less for the UPS facility and more for the filtering of surges/spikes.
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On 16/11/2018 09:39, Robin wrote:

Good point. We're in a fairly rural location - sharing a mains transformer with one other house, on the end of a long cable run - but the other PCs in our house seem to run perfectly happily off the mains - so perhaps I don't really need the UPS at all....
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If you allow it to do a periodical battery test it switches to battery power. And if the batteries are in poor condition loss of power output can result. I agree with whoever suggested this as a cause. It may be best to not allow scheduled battery tests but test the battery periodically with the OS shut down.
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On 16/11/2018 10:20, Roger Hayter wrote:

I think that's what's happening. Back when I got this unit (probably ten years ago) I did spend a little time trying to 'talk' to it from the PC - but never did manage to establish any sensible comms... Probably, if you can do that, there'll be some config that will turn off the self-test....
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On 16/11/2018 10:20, Roger Hayter wrote:

You have to put some load on it to test it? 100w incandescent lamp, maybe? There has to be some use for the old light bulbs I've hoarded.
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