Ground Source Heating

Is GSH really worth the huge installation cost ?

I got an estimate for my house, 9385+VAT for the ground loops, tanks and pumps, 3K for the under floor heating to go with it, plus say 2000 install charges. That will get me (at best) 4 units of heat out, for each unit of electric in, 3 from the ground, 1 from the spare heat of the electric.

With the cost of a simple electric fires, install cost is 1-2K.

If I need 8 KW to heat my house on a very cold day, and I heat it 12 hours a day, for say 150 days a year.

I work this out as taking 10+ years to get to break even. Once you get to breakeven costs for the GSH are attractive, but its a long haul to get there.

Do other people get the costs in the same ballpark ?

I then took a look at a coal fueld boiler, and got the break even point with GSH into many decades, long past my death anyway. Does this sound reasonable ?

Gas is out of the question, oil seems a bad choice, there is only one delivery agent in my area who use a tractor. I have no room to turn a waggon at my house, but a tractor, in summer, can turn in the fields.

Thanks Rick

Reply to
Rick
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How much roof area do you have? A simple heating circuit running from a pipework system on the roof can give much better solar heating than GSH systems can. If your roof faces the right direction (south in most cases), then a solar hot water collector on the roof is a viable alternative to GSH.

Reply to
BigWallop

The only sensible roof space (facing SW) is shaded by a massive oak tree :-(

The oak tree is not removale, its owner will not let me take it down, its probably hundreds of years old.

Rick

Reply to
Rick

A whole full solar roof is far different from a panel or two and may cost less than the 9k for a geothermal heat pump, which you have to pay to run. A solar roof is just the cost of running a pump. At best a heat pump can compete with a natural gas boiler in running costs. Using a Large thermal store with UFH make sure the UFH is "very" low temperature, that is installing more pipework under the floors.

A heat pump may have a COP of say 3. That is for every kW you use it outputs

3kW. But in winter you will freeze, or make the ground very cold, so less heat is available to pump into the house. Then the COP drops. When the ground gets very cold around the bore pipe, the heat pump may not be capable of raising the water to DHW temperatures. For example, a heat pump with a COP of 4 takes 1 unit of electrical energy and pulls 3 units of heat energy from the ground, water, etc, to supply 4 units of heat energy where needed. If the heat pump cannot pull the heat energy from somewhere, the COP drops back to 1.

Then expensive to run electric immersions have to be used, as well also with a COP of 1.

Assess a full solar roof, on a southish facing roof, heating a large thermal store that provides very low temepearure UFH and DHW. You may need a backup immersion in the thermal store for cloudy days. Also increase insulation levels, and make the house more air-tight.

Reply to
Doctor Evil

================ Are you being a bit hasty in ruling out gas? Calor gas can be delivered in bulk to a large on-site tank. It would appear to be a viable alternative to oil and much cheaper than GSH.

Cic.

Reply to
Cicero

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reckon about half that for a typical installation, and you can get a 1200 pound grant. No, it is not worth it, none of them are, unless you are lacking mains electricity.

Cheap rate overnight electricity into a central storage widget might be worth considering in your situation (especially if you want UFH anyway), with top-up electric fires.

Reply to
Nick Finnigan

LPG is quite expensive. It is by-product of oil. Capital cost is far is cheaper, as they use normal gas boilers. Running cost can be a lot higher than a well installed heat pump. But, what you save in installing a heat pump pay for a hell of a lot of gas over and above the electricity you use.

In the USA heat pumps are popular as they also use them to cool as well. As we don't have that requirement in the UK, they are an expensive fad most of the time.

Reply to
Doctor Evil

Gas can only be delivered 1/3 a mile from my house, else the choice would be easy. There are no local gas delivery compaines that deliver by tractor, there is no turning room at my house, you have to have a car, or a tractor. I could dig in a 1/3 of a mile pipe for a few grand, it would have to go into the existing track, which does not strike me as wise.

Rick

Reply to
Rick

Or if no natural gas pipes, keep to oil. Low capital cost. With what you would save over a heat pump installation, you can buy a hell of a lot of insulation,: cavity wall, loft, etc and make the house more air-tight.

Reply to
Doctor Evil

Wouldn't it be cheaper to put in a turning area for small tankers? Tank tracking would sit under the grass and not be too visible...

Reply to
PC Paul

I live on the top of a glaciated valley, 15 foot from my house is a very steep 100 foot drop, the other way its still pretty steep, the farmers only take the tractors in the fields when its dry, and having seen a 6 tonne excavator slide on the field I can understand why. I'd end up moving thousands of tonnes of stuff to acheive a turning circle :-(

On the other hand, I have an a wonderfull view from my bedroom window, and virtually no possability of sombody building a phone mast neerby :-)

Rick

Reply to
Rick

Thats what I just started working out, my simple maths has got it taking 10 years to break even over simple electric heaters, and 85 years for a coal boiler.

I wanted a windmill when I brought the house, its in a National Assembly windmill approved area, but the concensous of local people is that they are windmill haters.

Rick

Reply to
Rick

The basic price for the turbine, after the grant, you could maybe justify. Adding the support and control gear doubles the cost, and then you need exceptional conditions for it to be worthwhile.

Reply to
Nick Finnigan

I would agree with IMM/DrE except that electric will have an even lower capital cost than oil.

You could have just a little windmill, make your own savonious rotor out of an old oil drum, just for the fun of it.

Owain

Reply to
Owain

Three of my colleagues have created small wind turbines from vehicle alternators and kids toy car gear boxes. They provide battery charging on remote sites that have no services installed. Very good idea for LV lighting systems or battery powered heating systems. Wind turbines don't need to be really huge and complicated for them to work well.

Reply to
BigWallop

Well if you're not even prepared to try....

;-)

Reply to
PC Paul

How much would it cost to build a turning circle in the field? Then you could have anything delivered.

Andrew

Reply to
google

===================== It doesn't have to be a turning 'circle' - it could be a turntable as used by steam railways. People have used them on a small scale for turning cars in their drives to avoid reversing into main road traffic.

Cic.

Reply to
Cicero

One of those for 2K and he's still ahead of the game.

Reply to
Doctor Evil

Very heavy. Much better to fabricate something out of aluminium/plastic sheeting.

Reply to
s--p--o--n--i--x

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