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Earth needed?

Davey expressed precisely :

TS will be flooded with complaints about illegal electrical fittings from Amazon, better to make your complaint to Amazon, but explaining the UK regulations.

Reply to
Harry Bloomfield, Esq.
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My attitude in this case is that it is a part finished kit, and I would replace the cord with a three way earthed and rewire it completely.

forget trading standards - leave photos and bad feedback on Amazon.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

This I have now done.

Reply to
Davey

Yes. They have teeth, to help stop substandard and unsafe things coming to market.

It's the same if you get contaminated or bad food, and for all sorts of other things. Take it to TS, NOT the vendor, who will (at best) apologise and probably do nohing.

Reply to
Chris Bacon

Ha, Ha!

Reply to
Andy Burns

The seller information on Amazon shows:

maojianqu chaoyangnanlu25hao shiyanshi hubeisheng 442005 CN

So I think it safe to assume that it probably does not conform to established UK safety standards.

In this circumstance I would treat it as class I unless you can tell from the wiring that it is actually double insulated[1].

So replace the flex with 3 core, and crimp an eye terminal on the end of the earth wire, and use a self tapper to fix that to the metalwork (drill out the hole a bit if required)

Spose you could...

[1] reinforced sleeving over all the single insulated wires where they pass through the metalwork, and an insulated lampholder.
Reply to
John Rumm
[snip]

Also their 'Technical Details' are very confused:

Shade Material ?Brass - looks like glass to me Type of Bulb ?LED - the description further up their page says the bulb is not included Wattage ?40 watts - with a LED !

It gives the impression that the person who wrote the description knows very little about the product.

It might be OK but I'd be very wary of an electrical item from a Chinese Amazon Marketplace seller with such a vague description.

Reply to
Mike Clarke

Yes, it's like saying, "I've got my seatbelt on so I can drive like a maniac."

Bill

Reply to
williamwright

Chris Bacon expressed precisely :

You cannot take it to TS anymore, you have to go via the CAB first.

Reply to
Harry Bloomfield, Esq.

+1 An RCD makes it a bit safer, but even if it trips - that is still not a guarantee that you will survive the experience.
Reply to
Harry Bloomfield, Esq.

Glad you've come round to my way of thinking John!

Bill

Reply to
williamwright

So, what would you do in the OP's case? You have bought chinese electrical goods from Amazon (not from a street market, say) and they turn out to have a metal case. Maybe they have a CE mark, and the double insulated symbol. I imagine that a high proportion of such goods are safe, but trading standards and other consumer bodies do report occasional breaches. Do you take it apart to check the construction yourself? Perhaps do a megger test? You and I know how to do that, but I suspect that a good few posters here would not. Hence the request for advice.

Reply to
newshound

Can't disagree with any of that, though as TNP suggests I'd also give suitable feedback on Amazon.

Not sure how the Amazon seller info is any guide, but the absence of markings is the real warning. But what would you recommend for Chinese stuff that *does* have the markings? I just checked my desk light (one of those 12 volt halogen jobs with two "radio aeriels). It has all the markings, but what are the chances that these are faked?

Reply to
newshound

If I'm going to buy a Lucky Golden Hedgehog, unless I need it fast I've come to the conclusion I might as well buy it from Aliexpress for a third of the price. It'll take a bit longer to arrive (some sellers have a '10 day' promise and most things have been pretty good of late, especially since the new VAT changes means there's no risk of courier import fees) but I see no reason to pay the Amazon tax when they're adding no value and intentionally making it hard to search for things in order to railroad me towards junk that makes them the most profit.

It's rather amusing to search on Alibaba for your item and discover what the actual price of the selfsame item is before the Amazon tax.

Theo

Reply to
Theo

I was never against your way of thinking, but did think it worth highlighting that making something class I when it might already be class II does have negative safety implications in some circumstances. As always the devil is in the detail.

Reply to
John Rumm

Yup might help.

It gives you a clear indication of the source of the product.

Personally I would check it anyway. It's also quite common to find chinesium electrical stuff fitted with a stub of 3 core flex, which when you test continuity between the earth wire and the case, you find it is open circuit.

If you buy from Amazon or eBay you have no real way of knowing... if you buy from CPC for example, then usually there is a fair confidence that it's legit IME.

Reply to
John Rumm

newshound explained on 25/10/2021 :

I would be able to make it safe for UK use, possibly by ensuring it was fit to be classed as double insulated or add an earth - but if not or maybe as well I would in the past have reported it to TS. Now a days, that is not so easy.

Megger test, no. A visial inspection is much more important.

Advice has been given, it is though up to the OP what to do about it.

Reply to
Harry Bloomfield, Esq.

No you do not. Why the hell would the CAB have anything to do with TS?? Pffft.

Reply to
Chris Bacon

Really? If you have doubts, go and try to find out how to contact TS - You will get referred to the CAB as a first filter. CAB might then pass your issue to the TS.

Then you can come back here and apologise..

Reply to
Harry Bloomfield, Esq.

In the end it is full on *caveat emptor*.

I just bought a guitar from China, made by a joint Chinese/korean guitar maker. (Zuwei or Starshine) It is a chinese copy of a Jim Adkins Fender telecaster custom. The picture showed a glued in neck and natural ash body. The 'specifications' said bolt on neck and a tobacco sunburst.

It was less than a third of the price of what it 'copied'

It arrived today. I was prepared for anything, but I got zero customs charges, no handling fee or VAT, guitar exactly as the picture said and, given it was a budget clone, very well made.

I will of course take it to pieces and upgrade the pickups which are not great, and maybe spend some money on better switches and pots, but it is accurately made and looks wonderful.

And that is the point. China is cheap, but you need to rework it to standards. I bought a desk lamp from Homebase that was uber cheap and the last one left and didn't actually work, so it took it apart. It needed bending a bit and some connections remade, and IIRC it is twin core and un earthed, but I looked at it and it was safe enough. I accept that it is possible for a combination of events to make the case live, but they are extremely unlikely and the lamp would stop working first. If I gave a shit I would rewire it with three core and earth it

If you want nanny state goods, buy from John Lewis at 5 times the price. If its Chinese, use your common sense and check it out before and after you buy it.

I buy lots of Chinese stuff. Some is bin fit only. Some works with a bit of fiddling. Some is really first class.

You can save a lot by exercising common sense and basic technical understanding

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

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