Credit Control?

[soup]

£22K for that?

Nope, £15,000 for that and a conservatory

[Man at B&Q]

=A315K for the original porch *and conservatory*. I'd say =A37k for the demolition job was a bit steep, though.

MBQ

[Bob Eager]

He said the deolition cost him about 1.5K. The rest was other costs (presumably debt chasing, etc.)

[Andy Hall]

Even so, 5.5k to chase a 15k debt........

His legal representative must be rubbing his hands with glee.

[Doki]

Seconded. They were on about this on the breakfast news the other day, up front payment, and builders asking for cash for materials part way through jobs. I'd tell them to bugger off. Why should the customer prop up the builder's cashflow? Doesn't work like that in any other businesses - more usually the customer has a grace period to pay...

[Tanner-'op]

>>>>>>> Not a good businessman for several reasons:

Then those that give that amount of deposit are idiots Dave - as I said, I would only pay 10% maximum and the rest either in stages or on satifactory job completion.

I accept it works both ways, but there are more customers scammed than builders - especially those who dp not know the system.

Then you are one of the 'good' ones, but still would not use your services if you asked me for such a large deposit.

All the best,

From a very old, retired builder himself!

Tanner-'op

[The Medway Handyman]

But why should I finance the customers project? Without any guarantee of payment? Look what happened to this guy - £22k or whatever down the swanee - could put him out of business.

Never mind Rouge Traders what about Rouge Customers? They exist as well.

Certainly does work in other business's. Plumbers want 50% upfront for boiler installs aroud here.

[tinnews]

What have red traders and customers got to do with it?

[Tony Bryer]

But from the builders pov, why should he be expected to advance thousands of pounds to someone he doesn't know, especially given that if the client doesn't pay, recourse to legal action is likely to take a prolonged period with no certainty of immediate payment at the end of it. In my BCO days I came across rogue builders, but rogue clients too.

I've had a solicitor and accountant both do work for me recently, and each has asked for a significant deposit.

[PeterMcC]

[e-mail] wrote in

It's the blush of embarrassment?

[Doki]

Not neccesarily without guarantee of payment. I'd be happy to agree 10% up front, £x per week up to a total of £x until stage 1 of the project is complete, with the project split into a suitable number of stages which it is easy to assess completion of, and a retention of perhaps another 10 or

20% payable upon satisfactory completion.

Hence the need to draw up a contract.

It doesn't particularly happen outside of the building / plumbing trade though. Tesco and the like stock their shelves with wares with no guarantee that I'll be popping in for a pint of milk that day. My barber doesn't want half his money up front.

In pretty much every other line of business, you have to manage your cashflow, or you go out of business. Most businesses want CoD when working with the public, granted, whilst payment terms are generally available for trade custom. The jobbing building trade (as opposed to those contracted onto large developments) seem to have sidestepped managing their own cashflow almost entirely (ie with decking - I imagine 50% covers you for all your materials and a good chunk of the labour involved). I suspect if they had to, a lot would go out of business - not a because I doubt the financial acumen of the building trade but simply because it's what kills most businesses.

[Anne Jackson]

The message from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

She twice gave him a cheque which bounced. The banks charge the _depositor_ for that, don't they?

[ARWadworth]

> Not

You cannot ask to see the deeds to the house when doing a quote just to prove they are not tennants.(1)

That was total madness. Work stops immediately the payments are missed.

For the cameras and newspapers though. I suspect that he will not lose out in the long run.

Oddly enough the worst payers are builders IMHO.

Adam

(1) I swapped a fuse box for a CU a few years ago and when I asked for payment the customer gave me the landlords telephone no. The landlord knew nothing about this when I called him and told me to remove the CU and leave the tennants without electricity.

[Andy Hall]

He does almost live in France. The border crossing is but a short trip down the M20.

[Andy Hall]

Land Registry

or did you mean the fizzy drink?

[Bob Eager]

First he has to cross the border at the top of Bluebell Hill! :-)

[Anne Jackson]

>

Beer drinkers! What can you expect...?

[fred]

In article , nightjar writes

Ah, thanks.

I'm surprised it didn't get a mention in uk.legal

My skin isn't feeling quite thick enough to raise it there myself just now.

[Tanner-'op]

As an ex-BCO you know that is normal. Most bona fide builders will have sufficient capital to fund the size of works they carry out (and let's keep it the small/medium firms) and enough to cover the odd bad payer - and before the works begin, would normally agree with the client the following:

A The amount of deposit - if any (and normally around 10%).

B The Method of payments (cash, cheque etc).

C When the payment will be made. I.E At the end of the job or in regular, incremental stages (usually every month) - and based on the work completed at the time and materials on site (which the become the property of the client).

D The amount of retention to be held back by the client upon practical completion (around 15%) and the period of retention (around 6 months).

E The latent defects period applicable after final completion.

All of the above would then be incorporated in a written quote/estimate along with any other terms and conditions and given to the client to sign - thus forming a contract.

The above is a general outline and would have been used in my CoW days some time ago.

Under *NO* circumstances (in my opinion) should a builder start the works before the above is agreed (and as you say, there are rogue clients) and neither should there be a reason for the client to be asked to pay a large sum up-front i.e more than a 10% deposit - or cash "for materials" *before*

*ANY* work is started.

Well. I must admit, I have never been asked for *any* deposit by a solicitor before he carried out works for me - but I have had a solicitor waive his (rather considerable) fee because he inadvertantly gave me some 'bum' advice - and another has given me a handsome discount for works he did in a rather contentious Power of Attorney 'battle' involving a late parent.

As for Accountants - I have never had to use ones services!

Tanner-'op

[Tanner-'op]

Try uk.legal.moderated - they are less aggressive :-)

Tanner-'op