CH joints

I know very little about many things and plumbing is near the top of the list. Long story, but simple question.

My son has this largish late 50's/early 60's house in need of some work. He has ripped off the fake wooden panelling in the entrance hall in preparation for network cabling and then plastering.

It seems to be a good time to replace the radiators, some of which are still blocked even after a power flush, so, when the man came to sort out his oil fired boiler, they chatted and he now has a drained system and 3 radiators sitting outside the garage.

There will obviously be some slight re-arrangement of pipework to accommodate replacement radiators and valves. The existing pipes are copper and the visible joints are soldered. Apparently, son said he wanted all pipes to be soldered, but the plumber seemed surprised and said he would use compression joints with olives.

I am not sure about olive joints. We have had small leaks in our house after plumbers have changed radiators, and a couple of winters ago a spectacular ice sculpture formed where a joint failed behind one of son's garden taps.

I keep telling him to do a proper job rather than a bodge, and I have this gut feeling that solder is more likely to last the next 50 years than olives, so should we be looking at changing plumbers?

The house also came with an operationally superb bathroom suite in a horrendous dirty pink colour, so he will need more plumbing if he fails to follow my advice and bathe with his eyes closed.

Reply to
Bill
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Neither compression nor soldered joints are a bodge - they will both last 50 years if done properly.

Use whichever joint is most appropriate to the particular bit he's working on.

Solder for the visible runs would look better.

Solder may be easier onto the existing pipework which may be slightly deformed or contaminated.

Reply to
Tim Watts

From that era, it will probably also be imperial.

Reply to
Nightjar

As you found the big enemy of olive joints is movement so the joint can flex a bit. Avoid that and they seem pretty good to me. I've got Olive joints under my Kitchen to plumb in the Washing machine and we have worn out three machines without any leaks in the pipes.

Brian

Reply to
Brian Gaff

It sounds like he can't solder, so you need to find another plumber. Just be thankful he warned you in advance! (It might be he also doesn't know how to do compression fittings, e.g. all gunked up with PTFE tape or sealent - that's also rather common.) Personally, I prefer doing end-feed solder to using compression fittings. I only use compression fittings if I might need to temporarily disassemble sometime later.

Not a problem for 15mm solder fittings with 1/2" copper tube. For 15mm compression, you can get replacement olives to go on to the

1/2" copper, but usually the 15mm olives will work fine on it. For 3/4" copper, you need a proper adaptor to go to 22mm.
Reply to
Andrew Gabriel

It it possible he's got liability insurance that excludes "hot working"?

Reply to
Andy Burns

I believe he is OFTEC registered, whatever that means.

Reply to
Bill

Doesn't it simply depend on which joint? Most joints in a run would normally be soldered, but the final connection to the radiator is normally a compression joint, in my experience. The choice between the two is normally made on the basis of appearance and cost, but a properly made compression joint shouldn't be any more likely to leak than a soldered one. Then, of course, there's push-fit.......

Reply to
GMM

On 07/08/2014 22:24, GMM wrote: ...

Not in my house. They are all Yorkshire soldered fittings, although I would have used end-feed had I done the work myself.

Reply to
Nightjar

I'm surprised at a plumber wanting to use compression fittings, except where there is no option. Perhaps he only calls himself a plumber.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Reply to
Tony Bryer

No insurance at all?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Properly made compression joints are no less secure than soldered joints an d often far easier to deal with if they leak compared to a soldered joint. Every radiator valve has a compression joint where the pipe connects so you cannot avoid them completely anyway. Other instances where you might use t hem is where you may be soldering near cables which you cannot adequately p rotect with heat deflecting mats or pipes which you cannot completely drain of all the water or where woodwork could be set on fire.

Richard

Reply to
Tricky Dicky

Compression joints are a perfectly acceptable way of joining pipes and have a very long proven track record of success when used correctly.

However they are more expensive, and somewhat unsightly in many cases. Even in a "fully soldered" heating installation you will likely still have some compression joints at every rad valve etc though.

Reply to
John Rumm

Radiators have a threaded connection, but that is not the same as a compression fitting.

Reply to
Nightjar

errrr - how do the pipes connect to the rad valves without a compression fitting?

Reply to
no_spam

The point is a properly made solder joint doesn't leak. It is also much cheaper and neater looking. Cost on a full central heating installation is significant.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Olive/compression joint are as good as soldered joints. They cost more but are useful when there's water in the pipe that's hard to get rid of, (Soldering joints won't work when there is water about.)

Also useful when the pipe surroundings are very flammable & you don't want to use a blowlwmp.

Reply to
harryagain

They are more likely to leak at some time in their life than a properly made solder joint. And anyone who calls themselves a plumber should be able to make a solder joint properly.

The question here is about major works where it will be totally drained down, or new.

You use a heat proof blanket under those circumstances - again something a plumber would have.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

My insurance explicitly excludes hot work in the loft. Too near the thatch.

Given the cost difference I expect to have to keep an eye on any plumber...

I use compression, because I don't have the capital costs of the mats and the blowlamp. Given the number of joints I make compression works out cheaper. The only time I've ever had a problem was repairing a bit of pipe I'd managed to put a nail through - it wasn't quite round, nor straight. Once I'd got it to seal properly it never gave any further problems.

Push fit, OTOH... my son's flat had a flood caused by a tap failing wide open. So as the bathroom needed redoing anyway we got a new suite put in. Second night the feed to the toilet popped off. Finished off the ceiling and wrecked the replacement stock in the ground floor shop :(

Andy

Reply to
Vir Campestris

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