The only WC which my F-I-L is able to use at home (stroke, bust hip etc) ha= s soft close hinges which have become lose where they attach to the WC pan.= =20
Photos are here
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anyone know for certain how to tighten said hinges? I'm afraid that a= nswers along the lines of "I think" or "It should" won't be helpful because= F-I-L cannot be without the WC and chunks of the hinge fixings disappearin= g into the base of the WC as a result of undoing the Allen screws and the s= eat becoming even more lose isn't acceptable.
I've looked all over the WC and can't see any maker's names.
First, clean the toilet pan (and hinges). Take it as read that you *will* drop something down there. ;-)
Second, *I think* you just need to remove the allen grub screws and then the hinges will lift off the pan. You'll probably be left with some sort of stud that it may be possible to tighten "blind" if you're lucky or you may need to gain access to the bottom ends of the studs. How easy or hard that is depends on the design of your pan.
My pan is a "back to wall/panel" variety and I have to remove the panel behind the pan if I want to get to the bottom end of my studs but as long as the retaining nut hasn't actually fallen off, you should be able to tighten them from above.
soft close hinges which have become lose where they attach to the WC pan.
answers along the lines of "I think" or "It should" won't be helpful because F-I-L cannot be without the WC and chunks of the hinge fixings disappearing into the base of the WC as a result of undoing the Allen screws and the seat becoming even more lose isn't acceptable.
Tighten in what way? Are the hinges loose on the pan, or loose on the seat. Or is the the 'soft close' that is less soft? Precise questions begat precise answers.
soft close hinges which have become lose where they attach to the WC pan.
answers along the lines of "I think" or "It should" won't be helpful because F-I-L cannot be without the WC and chunks of the hinge fixings disappearing into the base of the WC as a result of undoing the Allen screws and the seat becoming even more lose isn't acceptable.
firstly, asking for a definitive answer is not going to happen, this is uk.d-i-y, you need to take some initiative and responsibility, otherwise you need to "get a man in" (who will probably just say it needs replacing if they break it trying to fix it)
Even if your toilet looks like one someone else has, it may be a different revision.
The hinges look very similar to mine, but not exactly the same (the grub screws on mine face the cistern) mine consist of two studs that are pushed into the pan, then screwed in to open an expanding part which wedges them in, and then the hinge slots over them, and is tightened with the grub screws.
firstly try simply tightening the grub screws, as these can work loose over time, this is very low risk, and shouldn't result in anything going down the pan, but do so at your own risk etc...
If this does not solve it, then the studs may have come loose, you will need to undo the grub screws (but shouldn't need to take them out totally) and the hinge should then separate from the pan. On mine, the hinges are not attached to the seat, they are just pushed on, so come of easily, so be prepared for them to fall off if you tilt the seat, or sneeze.
The two hinges are probably not the same as they have to soft close in two different directions, so make sure you put them back where they were, facing the same way (mark one L and the other R before taking them off, or you might break them (the instructions for mine warned if this, and they came pre-marked)
) has soft close hinges which have become lose where they attach to the WC = pan.
at answers along the lines of "I think" or "It should" won't be helpful bec= ause F-I-L cannot be without the WC and chunks of the hinge fixings disappe= aring into the base of the WC as a result of undoing the Allen screws and t= he seat becoming even more lose isn't acceptable.
Hi Toby
I think that my request for a definitive answer was a reasonably successful= attempt at discouraging the 'I think' answers :-)
If it wasn't the poor chap's only WC I'd take a fairly 'gung ho' approach. = =20
Incidentally, the grub screws seem to tighten the exposed portion of the hi= nge (the soft close part) onto some sort of lose pillar that protrudes thro= ugh the pan and I have a horrible feeling that losening them could result i= n a clatter as the pillars dissapear into the bowels of the bowl :-)
Perhaps I should have approached the problem form the other end and asked: = how do I attach a WC seat to a WC pan that has concealed hinge fixings. Wh= at do you think? =20
Doesn't look like it and you aren't likely to get a definitive answer anyway.
Can you get at or see the other side of the pan from the hinges? I think possibly not but you don't state if this a conventional type pan or a flush back to wall type.
In the closeup image of a hinge why is there that "spacer" bit between the seat and chromed hinge? Should that be fully inside the chromed hinge part like the otherside? Indicating that the hinge has moved to the left?
If you loosened the grub screw the chromed hinge part can't slide left or right to come off what ever is underneath as it has a complete skirt. This indiactes that if you loosen that the hinge and seat will most likely lift off, leaving a fixing sub attached to the pan.
I'd then expect to find that the stub can be moved left/right and also gaining you access to the top of the bolt that holds the stub to the pan.
If you don't have access to the underside, then I'd expect the fixing to be some form of compressable rubber "bung" that expands into the hole in the pan as the bolt is tightened. That is not to say that the plumber who installed the loo used that type of fixing as he may have fittted the seat before fitting the loo whilst he still had access to the back...
All conjecture which you don't want but without carefully and cautiously taking it apart you ain't going to get much further towards fixing the problem. Just don't madly go undoing things loosen a bit see how they start to move, tighten back up if it doesn't seem right...
I think you need to stop being a wuss and just undo those grub screws. ;-)
Whatever you plan to do, you will have to remove the seat before you can replace or repair anything. If the seat is still attached to the pan I think it would be most unlikely that the pillars will disappear anywhere, they'll just be very "floppy". You'll probably find that all you need to do is to pull lightly on the pillars as you twist them up (to stop the back nut spinning) and then nip them up a bit tighter with a spanner or something to finish off.
Beware of over-tightening as it would be quite possible to crack the pan.
Well it depends on how the fixings are concealed. If it's a "back to panel" type pan then you need to either move the pan away from the panel or the panel away from the pan. In my case that meant removing the panel from behind the pan which was a lot easier than I was expecting. I just had to remove a small panel with a flush button above the maim panel and then the main panel could be slipped upwards and outwards. Then I could reach around to the inside of the pan casting.
Hi Tim. Indeed, if it was my WC I would 'go for it' and, if necessary, pop next door while waiting for replacement fixings to arrive or treat it as a continental loo. Unfortunately F-I-L can't pop anywhere.
What a great thought.
No, it's a seamless chunk of porcelain fixed against a solid wall.
I think we need another picture. Which way does the soil pipe go (if visible)? How about the flush pipe?
Personally I think that as long as the pins that the seat clamps to have a collar on them, they won't fall through and you'll be okay to remove the seat. If you do need access to the other end though it sounds like you will have to unscrew the pan from the floor.
A picture of the pan/cistern would be a be a big help.
I still think that if the seat hasn't detached itself already from the pan, you'll be fine to remove the grub screws and tighten up the retaining pins. You could always wrap some string beneath the hinges around the pins if you're paranoid about them dropping down into oblivion.
If you DO need access to the underside of the hinge pins, it looks like you'll have to strip the whole shebang down.
I would say do it sooner rather than later as eventually one of the pins may completely unscrew from its backnut and then you definitely will have to strip everything down (unless you're lucky and the pins are retained by a system - expanding plug say - that only needs access from the top).
Thanks for watching this thread. I think that you are correct about being = brave and that string slipped under the hinges and wrapped around the pilla= rs will give a modicum of confidence. It's truly unfortunate that it is th= e only WC that f-i-l can access. In view of this I will leave anf further = tampering until after Christmas. I know that you are right about fixing it= sooner rather than later, but if it falls to bits as a consequence of my i= nvestigations I will get a great deal of grief, whereas if it falls to bits= unaided, my parents-in-law will be forced to get it sorted.
All I can say is that these concealed fixings appear to be a recipe for dis= aster.
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