On Tue, 10 May 2016 06:43:17 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
I don't think that. I never noticed any increase in noise, and I
don't think I've ever heard tire noise.
But they'll pay for other things.
I have my top down 6 to 7 months a year in Baltimore, and when I
lived in NYC and only drove on the weekends mostly it seemed there was
one weekend day every month in the winter that it was warm enough to
put the top down.
Now that I don't understand at all. What does one have to do with the
They hadn't driven convertibles since they had horse and buggies or
rickshaws. It's not an increasing market there, but I don't see how
it can be declining.
I was never interested in the "Image of Fun and Freedom" but in actual
fun and freedom, and that hasn't diminished. When I was working,
the highlight of many spring, summer, fall days was the drive home.
I helped a friend rebuild it. He's got more cars than he can drive -
so I get to exercise one every once in a while. I prefer the MG over
the Fiat cinco even though it has a roof and windshield.
See if he gets the Isetta finished this summer.
On 05/10/2016 06:55 PM, email@example.com wrote:
The one I always lusted after was the Messerschmitt KR175. Helps to have
a death wish to go with it as you get run over by a Prius. One of my
more reasonable strange likes is the Citroen Traction Avant. At least
the 11's and 15's can outrun a determined bicyclist.
On Tue, 10 May 2016 20:55:27 -0400, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
I'd like a friend like that too.
Let me know. In fact if you could email his phone number, I would
I had a friend who gave away his beautiful big Cadillac, but instead
of giving it to me, he gave it to a rich guy in his NYCith building,
someone who could have bought his own, who retired it to his other
home in Florida, to frolic with his other cars.** I'm just kidding,
he's entitled to give it to whomever he wants and I'd be overwhelmed
if I had two cars. I need a wife to manage one of them.
**My friend otoh ran out of work and ran out of money and had to move
out of NYC after a lifetime of living there. But selling his
apartment gave him enough money to live for years elsewhere.
I'm amazed. I took a quick trip to Hemmings and there were quite a few
in the 15K range that looked presentable. Of course, by the time you
really go looking they might not be so attractive. Still, it's better
than the 911 craziness.
The fads always were unpredictable. I went to an auction and they
brought out a beautifully restored Corvair. It couldn't even get the
reserve and the owner looked like he was about to cry. The auctioneer
finally told him he didn't have to take the low bid, but that was all he
could reasonably expect. Fat fender coupes were in that year, Corvairs
On 05/10/2016 03:44 PM, email@example.com wrote:
I put a tonneau cover on the Sprite, fitting it on a hot summer day. It
looked sharp, a white cover on a dark blue car, you could bounce a
quarter off it.
The downside was coming home around 3AM in the cool of the evening half
in the bag and trying to snap the thing shut.
Same with the toneau on my '57n Fargo. It was made of convertible top
material - and if it was off when the dew hit in the evening, it was
off untill the sun bas bright!!!
The toneau on the Td is a rather loose fitting vinyl "tarp" with snap
On Wed, 11 May 2016 17:01:10 -0400, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
An ongoing problem with my Buick and one or two Lebarons was that, it
seemed, the vinyl would shrink. It got to the point where I had to
go to shopping center, attach a come-along to a light pole and to the
roof behind the rear window, and tighten it to latch the top. In
the fall. One year I hadn't latched it all summer.
But this Toyota is so easy to latch, and hasn't gotten harder over the
4 or 5 years I've had it, plus the top is a lot older than that. I
don't know if it's the original 2000 top or not.
And afaict, the difference is that it's canvas and not vinyl. So
why did they insist on using vinyl for so long?
And can't I get canvas for any model?
MOST converible tops over history have been canvas - some wiyh vinyl
impregnated - and some "canvas" is fully p[re-shrunk - some is not.
You can have a top made for any vehicle from any material you desire.
A bit more expensive than a pre-made off-the-shelf top
On Fri, 13 May 2016 01:04:17 -0400, email@example.com wrote:
I wish they'd told me about all this years ago. My first replacement
top was hard to latch when I picked it up, iirc, though it got a lot
I had one top guy who talked about that when I first went to see him,
without my bringing it up, about how he left the top a little more
loose so when it shrank it would be perfect. Great, I thought. Then I
go to pick it up and he tells me, "Just be sure to put up the top
before it gets dark." Huh? Some of the best time is at night, warm
or cool. That might have been the top that needed the come-along to
No top guy out of at least 4 suggested canvas, and the JC Whitney
catalog, which might have had canvas, didn't convince me to buy it, so
I bought vinyl-impregnated because that's what it had and what I was
On Tuesday, May 10, 2016 at 5:20:36 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:
Of course. Unless the funds for a vehicle are unlimited, one has to
choose which features to pay for. The numbers show that "convertible"
is not a feature that as many people as before are opting to pay for.
It's called math. More people are choosing an SUV over a convertible.
What's not to understand?
The "market" can be determined by the number of convertibles sold vs. the
total number of vehicles sold and expressed as a percentage. If the number
of vehicles is going up (as consumers in the Emerging Markets begin to
purchase vehicles) but the percentage of convertibles is going down, then
the *global* market is declining.
On Tue, 10 May 2016 17:50:50 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
Your phrasing. People may choose an SUV over a convertible, but that
does not imply the appeal of the convertible has changed. It only
means for those who buy the SUV that the SUV has more appeal than the
convertible, not that the convertible has less appeal than it did. It
reflects the fact that you can't get both features in one car.
Maybe it's one of many ways the market can be described but I think
it's the gross number of cars that matter, and the market is staying
the same, very low.
This is what that url says about India and China:
"And consumers in fast-growing markets such as China and Indiawhich
increasingly are dictating the strategies of automakersprefer the
enclosed comfort of SUVs and sedans as a barrier to smog and a buffer
from crowded streets."
Nothing about the market going down. And the last clause is one of
those unsupported leaps. To show that the appeal of SUVs and sedans
versus convertibles is influenced by the smog and crowded streets,
they'd have to show that people bought convertibles more when there
was less smog and less crowded streets, and that's not true and they
don't try to show it, and they don't even claim it. There were never
more than a teeny tiny number of convetibles in those two markets,
probably brought by rich Americans working there or American consular
officials or their families. The biggest supply of unsupported
leaps is found in the last sentence of most TV evening news stories,
and probably other similar offerings. If you pay attention to the
last sentence, it is usually a generalization, a conclusion, a moral,
a witticism, or something like that, and it is almost always
unsupported (or even stupid, but I'm referring to TV, not the url
Actually there are a lot of convertible models for sale, just no full
size ones except I think Rolls Royce. Not as many as before 1975,
but more than 1980.
Actually you CAN. What do you call a Jeep Wrangler Ultimate - or even
a Jeep Renegade? Even the ultimate SUV - the Hummer, was available as
a "convertible".Also, the Landy Evoque. and the Murano
CrossConvertible, There WAS also the RAV4 softop and the Suzuki X90.
I'm sure that's not an exhaustive list.
On Wed, 11 May 2016 16:27:08 -0400, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
That would be great. And I'm sure would be thrilled with your
suggestions. I didn't think of them because they're not for me.
I'm looking for it. ...
I found this, http://www.ebay.com/bhp/jeep-wrangler-unlimited-soft-top
but it afaict, the top only comes off the rear third** of the
passenger compartment. I'm usually in the driver's seat, far from
that. **but maybe there are roof panels for the first 2 thirds that
come off. That would be pretty darn good, I agree, even though it
still leaves the tops of the doors. But it's bad that the rear part
is canvas and has to be removed and replaced by hand iiuc.
is shorter, so there is only one door with windows, and the rest opens
up. Unfortunaately $207 only buys the top, not the car.
Here's a better picture of a 4-door top, and below are the many models
it fits. It doesn't seem to be very hard, not even the part above the
first two seats, but otoh, it clearly as ribs. Not sure what size it
folds to. Only $700 used:
I found this, "Auto review: 2014 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited is a
convertible family car"
but in the 4 minute review, he spends 20 seconds on the convertible
part ("there are two roof panels you can remove.... you can get a
canvas top." "you can take the top off".)
Did you know there used to be Checker taxicabs that opened up for the
passenger seat. Still a roof farther forward but nothing above or
behind them. 1930's or 40's until they stopped running.
AFAICT so far, this has an optional Targa top. Not enough for me.
This related: I don't understand why, but even if everything I'm
looking at I can see through the windows, it looks much better with
the top down. In the same way it's bad if there is something behind
the targa top, behind me, even if I'm not looking at it. I'd like to
get rid of the windshield too, but otoh, I don't want a jeep with the
canvas top that takes a bunch of work to attach. I like either the
electric top or the one in the movie "The Graduate" where he just
reaches behind and pulls up the whole top.
(But the opposite is also a problem. I can't use a hard top that
pulls off in one piece because I have no garage, no way to lift the
top off, and don't even park next to my own property. It's about 30
feet to the front yard and 130 to the back, with bushes in the way.)
Another one, "Also, the MySky panels are great in theory but not
necessarily in practice. They are lightweight panels that can be
removed to open up the Renegades roof. I found them easy to detach
and install for a nice convertible experience for around town and rock
climbing. " Not good enough.
I found this page from 2014, "The Jeep Renegade has an optional targa
top that I think is really cool, but what if we took it a step further
and made the Renegade a convertible. Thankfully, with the magic of
photoshop we can see what it would look like. It reminds me of the
Wrangler with no roof. "
On Wed, 11 May 2016 16:27:08 -0400, email@example.com wrote:
Not an SUV, but I just heard on the radio about an India-made
Picture 2 screens down. The Tata Nano. Not quite luxury, like I'd
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