I need to solve a water drainage problem. I need a source for pipe or tubing that will not break when the standing water in it freezes.
It doesn't matter if it freezes. I just need it to not break. It will be run100 feet horizontal just under the surface of the lawn.
Rubber hose run through a PVC conduit?
Rubber hose run through a PVC conduit?
good suggestion, aren't many pipe materials that will expand about
5% (10% along th ee pipe axis) without cracking or rupturing.Most plastics used for pipe yield at ~2% expansion
Polybutyl? (PB) might work....but I'd test it first.
cheers Bob
If you want to be sure it won't break there's no substitute for burying it at or below the correct depth (frost line) for your area. Check with local municipality or utilities.
Can you arrange the system so there is an air space in the pipe above the water?
Mark
Is this a gravity drain system, or are you pumping? If the former, why do you care whether the pipe cracks?
Well, if it freezes, it isn't going to do much good draining if there is a source that isn't frozen as could easily be the case in many situations.
What are you draining to have some context for a reasonable solution? What amount of water does it have to carry?
But, if it is open and a straight run, it's unlikely freezing will actually cause a heavy walled (Sch 40 or greater) pipe to break as there would be an open end for expansion relief. Whether a solid pipe is even needed is, of course, an open question (pun sorta' intended.. :) )
Gravity fed. The water is suppose to go from point A to point B when it is not froze. If it was cracked it would leak underground at that point and cause a bog.
If it does freeze then some sort of heat tape would be required, but if it was unbreakable it can't cause a bog to form.
It is 4 inch PVC right now but it can be made smaller to just accommodate continuous drainage as opposed to part time rainstorm volume.
A 100 foot pipe is to long to allow all of the expansion to be accommodated by the open end.
What is that?
No
Fail to understand the logic here. Making it smaller is almost guaranteed to increase the likelihood of a solid blockage if it does freeze as well as making the wall proportionally thinner. Making it larger (or adding a parallel would seem more advantageous).
But, you still don't explain enough about what the water source is or the configuration to make a rational answer of an overall solution rather than trying to solve a specific question which is only a subset of the actual problem.
As someone else noted, a perforated drain line (it's that black corrugated stuff they use in backfills around basements where the purpose in that case of the perforations is for water ingress to be carried away by the pipe) in a gravel-filled trench _might_ solve the problem. Sufficient grade to make the water flow so it doesn't ever stand in the pipe to freeze solid enough to break is also possibly another. Not enough info to really know much more specific to suggest.
An open end is unconstrained... :)
Or you could just fill a foot long section, plug it and put it in the freezer maybe?
Is it gravity fed to open air? In that case, most times it will be empty anyway. It will only freeze up when the underground part (or downhill end) is below freezing when the water supply isn't.
Unless the end is plugged, even if it's cracked, water should prefer flosing in the pipe to working it's way out into the ground. You'd get enough to encourage root-growth in that direction, but you shouldn't get a bog.
Unless you just like to see a lot of posts, don't make us pry the relevent details out of you. Where are you? (What climate). Where is the water coming from, and how much of it is there? Where are you trying to get the water to go? What's the intervening terrain? Is there power available?
--Goedjn
There is no downhill end. It is horizontal and will have standing water in it.
The present system makes a bog. That is why I need a pipe that will not break.
This post is an attempt to see if there are any realistic solutions to an existing broken drain pipe system. This is not my system but my uphill neighbors system. If I can come up with an easy solution for his water drainage system it will end my water bogged back yard. If not I will have to go to court to get it solved, but for now I am just looking for an easy way for my neighbor to fix his problem.
There is a continual flow of water. If that can be maintained then a one inch pipe will do good enough. If it plugs or freezes that will be alright as long as it doesn't leak underground and cause a bog.
This drainage system is a flawed system from my uphill neighbor. (Pool backwash, Funneled backyard slope to a manhole cover, Downspouts, Sump pump, Stupid engineering/neighbor) I don't care if it freezes or plugs as long as it doesn't break underground and saturate my downhill property.
plumbers are cheaper than attorneys.
snipped-for-privacy@mucks.net wrote:
That is why I posted my original post.
Yes but the OP asked a vey specfic questions.......IMO the wrong one
Your "problem description" (until ~10+ back & forth posts, guesses, questions) has been incomplete & vague.
If you want good viable soltuons you have to lay out the situation so people can understand, analyze & solve it.
I don't understand how water draining from your "uphill" (how much uphill?) neighbor's yard to a storm dran can have standing water & create a "bog"
Got to have blockage and / or a "low spot" in the run. Drains are not supposed to have standing water...mosquitoes!
Based on your peicemeal description:
don't worry about freezing, bigger pipe is better (3"+) , a 1" line in the application will not work, correct the slope issues so you have no standing water (no standing water, no freezing issues) , correct any blockage or potential for blockage.
A hundred foot run isn't thatn far but you need ~2' of fall along that length to get reiable flushing flow.
Fix the problem correctly.......like someone said plumbers (actually a landscape guy) are cheaper than attorneys (plus the result will be much more satisfying)
good luck YMMV
cheers
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.