OT Fuel Economy Standards

[Dean Hoffman]

. Vehicles sold in the U.S. need to average 40 mpg by 2026.

The motorcycles I've had over the years didn't do much better than that. They were all rice grinders under 1000cc.

[danny burstein]

My beloved Honda Insight has a sticker I put on the back "55 mpg on a bad day".

It's now 45 - 50 'cuz a: two decades od b: while the car doesn't weigh any more than when it left the factory, the driver, well.. c: [expletive deleted] E-10 mandate. Yes, putting 10 percent ethanol in that gasoline mix reduces mileage roughly 5%, making a hidden but real increase in fuel cost (you have to buy more...)

[Dean Hoffman]

The local Caseys has ethanol and regular unleaded priced differently. I'm not sure if the ethanol is cheaper enough to make up for the difference in energy content.

[danny burstein]

[snip]

Double check what you're seeing at the station.

All "normal", so to speak, gasoline, whether "regular" or "premium", is actually E-10, namely a 10% ethanol mix

This is the one that cuts mileage roughly 5% from "clean" gas.

The only one that usually gets the big "ethanol" label is E-85. Eyup, 85% ethanol.

(Which _clobbers_ mileage, badly).

Very roughly one station in 20 or so will have a pump that's "clean gas", and it'll typically be about a dollar more per gallon than the equivalent E-10

(That's simply because they can get it.)

Oh, you can also find "clean gas" at marinas, which, because they service a captive clientele, are outragously expensive.

There's a solid, if small, market for clean gas at the $1 "extra" because E-10 does horrendous things to (older) small engines like in lawn mowers, etc.

[invalid unparseable]

We are being crucified on a green cross.

[Clare Snyder]

Many stations here in Canada the regular is E10 and the premium is "clean" with the midrange being a mix of the two and roughly E5 to E7.5 I use the "clean" premium in all my small engines and a lot of guys use it in light planes with "Mogas" STC or "AutoGas" STC as well.

Also good for "dual fuel" coleman lamps and stoves and even with road tax included is a LOT cheaper than "coleman fuel" (Naptha)

[Marilyn Manson]

I'm still waiting to find out how long that takes.

I've been using E-10 in my Honda powered lawn mower for 25+ years and in my Ariens (LCT powered) snow blower for about 12. They both start on 2 - 3 pulls at the start of the season and 1 pull after that. They both run nice and smooth and neither is hurting for power.

[danny burstein]

[snip]

True enough, in that people who don't have problems aren't posting... so yeah, there's reporting bias there. But there sure are enough of them to suggest that for quite a few engines this is an issue.

[trader_4]

The liberals think that just because they require something by law, physics and the real world make it workable. Going from 28MPG to 40 MPG in 4 years is nuts. It's OK though, it will be added to the list of things the Democrats can run on in November and 2024.

[Cindy Hamilton]

How many 0 mpg electric vehicles do you suppose they're counting on to make the average be 40 rather than 28?

I might buy an electric vehicle if I were in the market. OTOH, since I only drive a few miles every week, the environment is probably better off if I keep my IC vehicles.

[Snag]

The station we usually gas up at has both regular 87 octane and premium 92 octane with no ethanol . The tractor , generator , and tiller get regular , the chainsaws and line trimmer get 50/50 (Stihl recommends

89) and the Harleys get straight premium . The cars aren't so picky ... and the cost per mile for non-E gas is just enough higher that I just use E10 .

[invalid unparseable]

I do not drive that much so the price of gasoline is not important. OTOH I do have a good sized house and have to use oil to heat and had to pay $4.95/gallon just this week.

[Snag]

I pay my heating bill with sweat and gasoline . Apparently I didn't pay enough last year , since I just ran out of firewood !

[Marilyn Manson]

So what's the root cause? Engine manufacturer? Brand of gas? Local environment? Luck?

I do use StaBil religiously, but other than that, nothing special. Gas is stored outside, in plastic cans, covered, but not enclosed. I don't stick to one brand either.

Oh yeah, the generator runs fine also, but that's only been around for about 5 years. It hasn't had anywhere near as much gas run through it as the mower or blower so maybe I'm killing it slower-ly.

[Ralph Mowery]

I think the main problem is fresh gas. That is On the small engines that are used every week or two there is not much of a problem getting them started. The problem is like a generator I have. It is only used once or twice a year at the most. If I leave the ethanol gas in it the gas goes bad and gumes up carborator. I have had to clean it out several times. Same with a chain saw. Clean it out and put in fresh gas of either kind and they start right up.

For the last several years I only use the ethanol free gas and run them empty when I am not planning on using them for a month or more.

Some of the older engines the ethanol will cause the 'plastic' parts and fuel lines to go bad.

[invalid unparseable]

Unfortunately ethanol free gas is not available where I live.

Happened in my snow thrower years ago using gas with ethanol. No problem if I ran it dry but storing stabilized gas in it clogged it up. Going back reading the manual it said not to use gas with ethanol. Someone that worked on small engines said problems can also be with evaporation of gas in carburetor.

Otherwise stabilized gas with ethanol has been no problem with me storing in generator or cans. Generator also has a shut off valve.

Gas goes bad on exposure to oxygen and if it contains ethanol it can absorb water to make problem worse.

[rbowman]

My Toyota, which is straight IC, gets about 35 mpg. I'm not planning to get rid of it anytime soon. It can get me about 300 miles before looking for a gas station which is nice in a state where there isn't a station every block.

[rbowman]

All my bikes normally get 87. Every now and then I treat the Sportster to 91 or straight gas but I haven't noticed a difference. The lawnmower and car get 87 which is usually 10% alcohol. In theory they only need to sell the blend in the winter months when the valley is susceptible to inversions but most stations have it year around.

[rbowman]

I was cleaning out the paperwork drawer and found a propane bill for $2.09 a gallon. The last fill up in January was $4.12.

That's as bad as finding old sleeves of primers marked $1.59.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Frank mentioned there were no stations near him with ethanol free gas. Looks like two in the state