installing 15 amp cabinet lights into a 20 amp circuit

More clarification:

The LED panel is definitely rated for a 15amp circuit. Basically, I am not sure if it is ok to run it on a 20amp circuit, and with the wiring method I drew in the diagram.

My questions were:

I don't read subject lines. Don't know about everyone else.

There's nothing technically wrong with what you are trying to do. But, there are LEGAL issues. I use the term "LEGAL" not because I can point to a statute. You may end up in court if someone is hurt or your house burns down.

Depending on where you live, there are codes and standards with which you must comply. I'm not an electrician and what I'm about to say may not use the correct terms or be precisely correct, but you'll get the gist...

If your fuse/breaker is 20A, EVERYTHING in the walls has to be able to handle that current. In the USA, that typically means 12 gauge wire of a type approved for that purpose.

You can't just "splice" wires in the wall. You have to put the splices in an approved electrical box using approved splicing methods.

Normally, you'd add a new electrical box at the light and run a wire all the way to the existing outlet box and put splices inside each box. You'd have to get an electrical permit and have the work inspected when done.

Depending on where you live, your transgression may never be discovered and enforcement may be non-existent. May not be a problem until you try to sell the house and are required to bring the electrical up to code. But, if anybody ever gets hurt, even after you sell the house, the ambulance-chasers might have a field day assigning guilt.

I have several projects I'd like to do where the cost of doing it right exceeds the perceived benefit. I resist those temptations to do it easy.

It is OK. The only possible code issue was what Don brought up, ie that kitchens are supposed to have 20A circuits reserved for receptacles for appliances and it's probably a code violation to hook up a dedicated light circuit. But this is a 15W LED and it really doesn't have a material effect on the availability of 20A at the receptacles. And that is a new requirement, I don't think it would apply to circuits installed prior to when the new 20A requirement went into effect.

As long as you wire it in at the box with the receptacle, you're OK. Only other possible issue would be not exceeding the wire fill capacity of the box.

Yes

No, the circuit is rated at 20A max, you're supplying it ~ 125ma, assuming it's really 15W. Whatever it is, it's an LED and insignificant.

One more (hopefully last) clarification:

The diagram I drew is actually incorrect. I was planning on placing the orange splice connections INSIDE the green box, not outside.

Is that code-compliant and/or safe?

I know he said that. It still sounds like regular wires to me.

But he's posted picture links and counting the whole thread I've got one loss and two wins. He doesn't want to use a plug. But I was right about what the wires look like. Even though he has

His drawing either shows no junction box, or it shows the connections made outside of the box!!!

I have my own home-made under-the-counter light, installed at least 25 years ago. Two sockets using those 110V hotdog-shaped light bulbs (like are used for bed-lamps) and a separate switch (none of which is visible, just behind the cabinet skirt), and a two-conductor wire (lamp cord). I put a plug on the cord and plugged it in. I used insulated staples or 2-sided tape or something to keep the wire up under the cabinet.

Last time I checked, Romex doesn't go through the receptacle cover or typically any cover at all.

Most houses today are using plastic boxes that have plastic tabs that squeeze against the cable. While it's intended for Romex, I certainly could live with the round cable going through it. As for tightening up so sparks can't get out, typical box isn't made to be spark tight to begin with.

He's clearly intending to make the connection inside the existing receptacle box. Good grief. Conductor fill might be a legitimate issue though, depending on what's in there already.

The thing that covers the hole. I don't know what it's called.

OK

Manhole cover?

Really? The receptacles are empty "probably" because the kitchen isn't in use yet?

The 2 duplex receptacles next my sink are only used for small electrics like hand mixers, the crock pot, the coffee grinder, etc. Things that are plugged in, used and then put away. The vast majority of the time they are empty. The unfinished counter tells us the kitchen is not in use yet, but empty receptacles tell us nothing other than that they are empty.

As for your "win" related to the cord. Your *assumption* was correct, while I chose not to make an assumption and to withhold a suggested method until we had the details. If your correct guess makes you feel victorious, enjoy the feeling.

And that is acceptable to you? In what world?

That is what I have been trying to get across to you all along. If this is to be done to code, he is going to need a junction box to accept the cord from the LED fixture. He will then need to run wire that is rated for in wall use to that junction box from a source. I could be wrong, but I'll wager that the cord from the led fixture is not rated for in wall use. Even if it is, it can't just be run through a hole in the wall.

What 2 c "The 3 wires coming out of the LED panel would get connected (spliced?) onto corresponding existing wires inside the wall."

Even if you have trouble reading, he included a picture.

Sparks? Do you think that the purpose of Romex connectors is to contain sparks? Wow!

If that isn't a reason for me to slowly back away from this conversation I don't know what it is.

Moving on...

That's it.

Adhesive bandage.

We're really going to quibble about "probably". Below you're proud that you don't make assumptions. So isn't it better to make a qualified assumption (probably) than an unqualified one?

Sink? There's no sink in the picture.

Not everyone works that way.

Who said that was the reason I thought it's not used yet? The reasons are that the counter has nothing on it, the paint colors don't match, and the edge of the paint is not straight. But that's not total proof so I said probably. See?

MMMmmmMMMmmm. Oh, that's good.

Where did I say it was acceptable? Four lines down I said " Plus if this is permitted at all (????)...."

That's what I said in an earlier post.

The white wire with the black and green wires inside it.

I see 2 wires and 2 shadows. He might have been wrong when he said there was a ground.

Look at it.

The purpose of junction boxes is to contain sparks and fire.

They would never put Romex on a less than 20 watt light.

Red herring. I didn't suggest those wires, you did.

What do you mean "no clue". I've seen 100's of electric lights.

The wires look just like I expected.

And he could put a plug on them. He just doesn't want to, and I understand that.

On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 9:04:17 PM UTC-5, Micky wrote: ...snip...

Look, I'm only responding to help you out. Maybe it's because I feel sorry for you.

I don't know what kind of monitor you have or what kind of device you are viewing those pictures with, but for some reason you are aren't seeing the neutral (white) wire. It comes out of the casing, goes behind the ground (green) wire, runs along the hot (black) wire and then goes behind the hot wire. Notice how there are *2* stripped ends right next to each other where the hot and neutral end.

He never said anything about a ground being there or not. All he said was "The 3 wires coming out of the LED panel..." and he was 100% correct. Tis you that are wrong.

Pop quiz:

Let's say the device only had 2 wires, a hot and a neutral. What color would expect those to wires to be?

...snip...

Maybe. There are two shadows, one darker than the other, for each wire, so it's certainly not clear.

The drawing showed three wires.

I'm still trying to figure out how your reading comprehension can be so low.

As long as you are replying to my comments in trader_4's post, I guess I'll respond here too.

Give up. There is no "maybe" that the neutral (white) wire is visible in the picture. You need to get a better monitor/device/eyesight. I can see the white wire on my PC, my iPad and my smartphone.

Maybe Car13 will be nice to you and verify the presence or maybe he'll move the wires and post another link.

Bottom line is that the neutral wire is visible in the picture, so any discussion that related to only 2 wires being available is irrelevant.

...because there *are* 3 wires.

I asked that question because of your assertion that there are only 2 wires. If we were to suspend reality and agree that there are only 2 wires and then apply your statement "He might have been wrong when he said there was a ground" do you really think that the wires would be black and green? In my experience, devices that only provide a hot and a neutral use black and white, not black and green.

Outside the US I would expect to see them brown and blue