computer Surge Suppressor-protector question

The meter socket surge arrester can be installed on any home or office electrical service. Pull the meter, plug in the unit where the meter goes then plug the meter into the surge arrester. At the electrical panel, a new type of surge arrester that plugs into an available two pole breaker slot is simple to install. You then plug your computer gear into your UPS or surge arrester power strip. It's all plug in and easy to do. :-)

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas
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Any idea what this would cost?

Reply to
Bob Villa

Turning them off doesn't do much for lightning/surge suppression if anything. Ive never lost a 'puter to lightning but I have lost a TV and several piece of test equipment I left plugged into my work bench..... They were turned off . As an electronics repairman over the years I have repaired many lightning damaged devices where all I had to do was replace the MOV. While I cant say with absolute certainty that this protected the device as I also have may crispy fried circuit s that had lightning protection I would say that the evidence I have seen leans in that direction.

Jimmie

Reply to
JIMMIE

I would agree the cascaded protection would be your best bet by far.

Reply to
Tony Miklos

Well almost. I couldn't use the meter socket since I have a current transformer set up. The electric I use doesn't go through my meter.

Reply to
Tony Miklos

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Off is when the hard wired switch on the P/S is off and/or the power cord is unplugged. Remember that this whole thread subject is about surge protection, just like your TV with a remote control, the pc is on unless it's unplugged. By the way, you don't leave the "wake on lan" option turned on do you? If you do it will allow someone to hack into your computer when it's "turned off" as you described above. (that is if the modem and/or router are turned on also and you have a connection to the internet.)

Reply to
Tony Miklos

Exactly, some surge protection systems have more layers than that starting at the PoCo's transformer, then the service entrance, isolation transformer. Signal lines have shunt to ground gas discharge suppressors, series inductors and shunt to ground solid- state devices on the other side of the inductor. I have seen surge protector boxes blown off the wall but the mainframe computers they were feeding were unscathed .

Jimmie

Reply to
JIMMIE

They can still put the PoCo surge protectors in a CT can. It is not really in the meter. They just use the meter base as a connection point.

Reply to
gfretwell

MOVs are voltage limiters. They are like parallel reverse connected zenier diodes.

MOVs have an energy (joule) rating. They can absorb as much energy as the joule rating (and at that point are still functional). This is a rating for a single surge. MOVs (and both service panel and plug-in suppressors) with very high joule ratings are readily available. If the energy hits a MOV takes are a small fraction of the single hit rating, the cumulative energy the MOV can absorb will be far larger than the stated rating. From another post, the energy dissipated in a plug-in suppressor is surprisingly small. If a plug-in suppressor has a very high rating it is likely to never fail. That is one reason why some of them have protected equipment warranties.

As detailed in another post(and at length in the IEEE surge guide below), some plug-in suppressors will disconnect the protected load if the MOVs fail and are disconnected. Another reason why some suppressors have protected equipment warranties.

The best information on surges and surge protection I have seen is at:

- "How to protect your house and its contents from lightning: IEEE guide for surge protection of equipment connected to AC power and communication circuits" published by the IEEE in 2005

The IEEE surge guide says "the vast majority (>90%) of both hard-wired and plug-in protectors use MOVs to perform the voltage-limiting function. In most AC protectors, they are the only significant voltage limiters."

I agree with trader.

If a device is not using a MOV it is probably marked as a feature.

Surges produced in the house are not likely to damage to equipment, which typically has an immunity level of 600-800V.

Service panel suppressors are good protection., The main hole left by a service panel suppressor is that it does not limit the voltage between power and phone and cable wires, which is likely to cause most damage. If phone and cable (and dish) entry protectors are connected to the power earthing system (as in gfretwell's post) and the wires are short, much of that hole is filled. It is still possible to get about 4kV between the coax shield and the center conductor, and a very near lightning strike can induce damaging voltages with the wiring inside the house acting as a loop or long-wire antenna.

UPSs seldom have ratings as high as are readily available in plug-in suppressors. And UPSs with a surge rating often are not listed under UL1449.

The best protection is a service panel suppressor, short wires from cable/phone/dish entry protectors to the power earthing system, and plug-in suppressors for expensive equipment (particularly if it has phone/cable connections).

And as stated elsewhere, if using a plug-in suppressor all interconnected equipment needs to be connected to the same suppressor and external wires (power/phone/cable/...) needs to go through the suppressor.

Meter base suppressors (supplied by the utility) provide protection. The IEEE surge guide talks about the length of wire used to connect a service panel suppressor - as the wires get longer the let-through voltage goes way up. In a meter base suppressor the earthing system is usually connected to the service panel neutral. That means the neutral wire from the meter to the service panel will raise the let-through voltage of the suppressor.

Reply to
bud--

The meter base suppressor works best if the ground electrode conductor lands in the meter base. You really want your grounding paths to be as short and straight as possible. You also want your cable and phone suppressors grounded right there.

The plug in, point of use protection is just supposed to be supplemental to that. A good plug in protector will also have smaller capacitors and maybe an inductive element, meant to shunt off high frequency transients (noise). I live in a place with a thunderstorm just about every day for 6-7 months of the year and I never unplug anything ... but I have several layers of protection for everything.

Reply to
gfretwell

What's he amp rating on your service? Is it 3 phase commercial? Do you have a BFS Big Freaking Switch on the main power coming in? :-)

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

But would those little wires to the meter carry the surge current? I think it's #14-#12 wire and there are usually fuses in the CT meter box to keep the small conductors from melting.

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

AH! At last, someone who groks. :-)

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

200 amp, single phase, one to the house and one to the garage, think of a farm type set up. Sorry I don't have a big freaking knife switch like in Frankenstein but that would be cool! Open air switch with no safety nutn'. Don't lean there.
Reply to
Tony Miklos

Grok, grok, grok.

Reply to
Tony Miklos

I don't really know, the power company in this area handles/leases the meter socket protection but the plug in surge arresters can be obtained from the local electrical supplier or ordered online. Of course every retailer seems to sell power strips and little UPS systems. :-)

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TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

We had a bad storm system come through The Southeast last week and I was sitting at my computer when I heard my UPS click and my electric heater reset/shut off (electronic control) then a few seconds later a very loud BOOM almost knocked my out of my chair. Computers and network equipment never skipped a beat but my heart did. :-)

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

On most of the CT metered service entrances I've installed, there is a big fused safety switch to kill the main power going into the building. This is so the fire department can knock the lock off and kill the power. At a home, the fireman will knock the power meter out of the can to kill the power. In your case, I suppose the power company didn't want multiple meters. :-)

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

Forgot that. Of course.

Oh, yeah. Of course.

Reply to
mm

So that probably means none of the tvs in your house are ever off except when you're moving furniture. Or any of the devices with a power transformer and a switch in the secondary circuit, which is most radios and lots of other stuff. I don't think many people use the word that way. If you want to say the computers etc. are on standby, I'd go for that, but not On.

OTOH, they're not really on standy unless one of the Wake functions is enabled and connected, and none of them are in my case. So what else is mine standing by for? For me to push the on/off button. By that token, the iron is standing by for me to move the temp lever from Off to Cotton. And the oven is standing by for me to turn the knob to oven. Hmmmm, depending on the orders given to it by the manufacturers, maybe even the stuff that hasn't been sold yet, is standing by in the stores for me to buy it, connect it, and turn it on.

I paid attention to this and I don't know about other computers but mine requires a jumper wire from the LAN card to the Wake-on-LAN connector on the mobo to be able to wake it via the LAN. No jumper's installed.

Reply to
mm

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