Central AC Advice

The installation of HVAC equipment is NOT comparable to a new car. The competency level of the installer will be the major factor in the life & service of central AC equipment. The major components in air conditioners are made by other companies & most companies use the same ones, with a few exceptions, and that does not mean that their compressor or other component is better than what the other AC companies are using. The Copeland Scroll is installed in many brand name ACs; are they better in your AC brand; me thinks not.

A bad install can ruin the best equipment on earth, and that includes the equipment you are boosting about! Additionally, the price differential on new Brand XX AC equipment, when equipment is properly installed with matching ductwork, etc., will NOT provide the buyer "with as good a payback" on the higher SEER. I am talking about the HIGH END of a Brand NOT the low end of any Brand! I firmly believe that the high end Models of, for example, Goodman condensers' with scroll Copeland compressors will perform & last with any other Brand.

I am a Retired HVAC/R Contractor and am not selling or promoting any AC Brand for monetary gain. - udarrell

Reply to
udarrell
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it's

I'm

Get a clue and see my other post.

I was ragging on the "this brand is better, BS".

Your installer *is* the end manufacture! HVAC equipment longevity depends on a proper installation. The brand doesn't matter!

Reply to
<kjpro

End of production date for R-22 equipment, 2010.

I&#39;d still install an R-22 system in my home today!

Reply to
<kjpro

Nonsense...

Reply to
xModem

At no time did I argue that the installer isn&#39;t an important element. It is extremely important. However, anyone claiming that equipment quality doesn&#39;t factor into it, and that the only important factor is the installer, is being disingenuous.

No argument there. By the same token, a great install on a low-end piece of crap still results in a low end piece of crap.

I wasn&#39;t advocating any brand of equipment. That was another poster.

So you&#39;re saying that there&#39;s a difference between high end and low end equipment? That puts us on the same page. That&#39;s always been my point.

Reply to
xModem

Let me rephrase that. With the _same_ installer installing two furnaces - one a low-end contractor-grade brand x, and a higher-end, higher-rated unit, statistically, the low-end, lower rated unit is going to have more problems.

Reply to
xModem

Often they&#39;re built in the same factory, just marketed differently.

Reply to
CJT

...

And, often they&#39;re not.

Might try looking at CR repair histories by vendor -- while not perfect data by any means, there are trends there that are probably realistic.

Reply to
dpb

Funny you should mention that. The other day, I grabbed an article off ConsumerReports.com, rating gas furnace repair frequencies. Naysayers should bear in mind; these aren&#39;t CS&#39;s own opinions. They&#39;re the result of a survey of 36,181 homeowners. Note that the survey was done in

2004 as well.

In order, from best to worst:

- American Standard

- Rheem

- Trane

- Ruud

- Bryant

- Carrier

- Heil

- York

- Amana

- Lennox

- Tempstar

- Goodman

Reply to
xModem

statistically,

Bullshit, the more features and safety controls you have, the more there is to fail.

Since it&#39;s painfully obvious that you have no experience in the HVAC/R industry, I suggest that you quit posting as someone who does. Someone my take your bullshit and believe it. That would be a shame!

Reply to
<kjpro

CR is a bunch of bullshit... do they account for improper installations?

No they don&#39;t and they are very often WRONG with their assessments!

Reply to
<kjpro

FFS, you don&#39;t need an HVAC background to understand a survey.

I&#39;ve never attempted to.

If I had an installer like you tell me that equipment quality didn&#39;t matter whatsoever, I&#39;d show him the door.

Reply to
xModem

Wouldn&#39;t you think that with 36,000 installs, there would be good and bad across the board?

Learn to read for comprehension. It wasn&#39;t CR&#39;s assessment, rather 36,000 other people.

Reply to
xModem

kjpro @ usenet.com wrote: ...

Their field reliability reports aren&#39;t their lab tests but reported failure reports.

So, to infer that the reliability differences reported between vendors over a large number of reports over a period of time is owing to installation would require that bad installations go with those brands

-- also a reason to avoid those brands if true, but certainly not likely. Far more likely is that the percentage of failures reported that is owing to installation is an approximately consistent fraction of all reports for each brand, hence leaving the overall equipment rankings as slightly more reliable than reported but in the same (or very nearly the same) relative position.

Reply to
dpb

Oh please, that&#39;s a bunch of crap! Do they ask if the installations meets the manufacture&#39;s specifications? No they don&#39;t!

But for enterainment purposes, lets assume they did and all things in these installations are equal.

From your list..

  1. American Standard is #1 while Trane is #3, yet it&#39;s manufactured by the same company!
  2. Rheem is #2 while Ruud is #4, yet it&#39;s manufactured by the same company! BTW, where&#39;s Weathermaker/Weatherking? It&#39;s the same thing too...
  3. Bryant is #5 while Carrier is #6, yet their manufactured by the same company! BTW, where&#39;s Payne? It&#39;s the same as well!
  4. Heil is #7 while Tempstar is #11, yet their manufactured by the same company! BTW, where&#39;s Comfortmaker, Arcoaire, AirQuest, KeepRite, Maratherm, Sears, etc? They&#39;re all the same as well...
  5. York is #8 where&#39;s Coleman? It&#39;s the same thing.
  6. Amana is #9 to bad they&#39;re owed by Goodman... LOL
  7. Lennox is #10 where&#39;s Armstrong, AireEase, Ducane, Aire-Flo, Concord, Magic-Pak, Magic Chef, etc... They&#39;re are manufactured by the same people.
  8. Goodman is #11 where&#39;s Janitrol? It&#39;s the same...

Where&#39;s Frigidaire, Westinghouse, Tappen, Philco, Kelvinator, Grandaire, Gibson, Maytag, Admiral, Inertherm, Miller, Quatro, Bard, Thermopride, Century, Heat Controller, Comfortaire, Consolidated, Fedders, and the rest of the major brands?

Don&#39;t try and tell me none of them are in the top ten either... cause I KNOW better!

Reply to
<kjpro

And all this information comes from someone OUTSIDE of OUR industry.

Now I&#39;d sure as hell take your advice over a professional any day.

Reply to
<kjpro

Try talking to someone with experience on the subject... I know!

Whatever, it&#39;s still a BULLSHIT report no matter who asked the questions...

Reply to
<kjpro

My own experience is backed up by facts. And the fact is... your conclusion of their report is complete BULLSHIT.

Reply to
<kjpro

Survey&#39;s can be swayed one way or the other... dipshit. The fact still remains that their report is BULLSHIT.

Then quit telling me about my own trade, Dipshit!

You wouldn&#39;t have to, I don&#39;t work for idiots!

Reply to
<kjpro

Were the differences statistically significant? At what level of confidence?

Reply to
CJT

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