Of some mind interest: the Environmental Working Group's
2019 top dozen pesticide contaminated vegi's:
Kale rejoins the 'Dirty Dozen' list as one of the most contaminated with
Is kale actually edible, even without the pesticides?
Of course! Do a search on "kale salad" and you'll get a ton of options.
We generally have a kale salad once a week. Tip: don't skip the
massage step when working the dressing in; it tenderizes the kale. The
springy curly kale seems to taste best.
we don't eat it. i like most veggies but not that
one much enough to grow it. there are so many other
things i'd rather grow and eat (strawberries, peas,
beans, tomatoes, onions, red peppers, dill and cucumbers
being the top fruits/veggies).
as far as i know all the above can be grown without
*cides if you have a competent labor force and use
decent soil community support/building practices. i
grow tomatoes and strawberries without any *cides at
T, think of where you were 5yrs ago with your gardens
and where you are at today? how is it going? :) are
you seeing improvements in green cover for your gardens
and growing spaces? is production improving are your
costs for water decreasing? etc. tell me how it's
going and what you'll be growing this year.
i'm still planning on putting up more fence but that
has mostly been paid for. we may have some plumbing
expenses coming up but other things have a higher
priority for now (after 22+yrs things are starting to
On Thursday, March 21, 2019 at 8:01:04 AM UTC-4, songbird wrote:
My wife plants kale every year for the decorative effect but we never eat it. One year, we had about three feet of snow. As it melted, the kale plant out in the garden emerged and continued growing.
That would make sense. Kale spent a lot of time in outer space
between galaxies, exposed to cosmic radiation, after being
banished by treaty as a genetically modified bio-weapon, to
the outer reaches of space as a failed attempt to subtly
destroy an opposing aggressors will to live by ruining
their digestion and love of life by masking a food like
substance as a health food whilst concurrently disposing
of expired vats of penicillin. Had lots of time to adapt to
all sorts of extremes and the absolute colds of space. After
all that, it should be able to withstand a little snow.
the tomatoes here get some kind of blight each
season but they still bear fruit and we get enough
so i've never treated for it. i have tried various
things recommended to eliminate it or reduce it
from happening, but each year it returns no matter
what. so since it doesn't cause us to lose the
crops i just continue to ignore it. the plants
look pretty sad by the end of the summer but by
then we've put up what we need so it's ok.
i would not use copper sulfate for long as the
copper can build up in the soil.
have you tried finding more resistant plants?
i have here but Mom is very fixated on what she
wants to grow so i gave up.
the troublesome weeds here are horsetail and
sow-thistle, but i've found out they can be
removed by manual methods and smothering once
you've got the worst of them cleared. you just
have to be sure to keep after any new ones that
may show up before they get going again.
Untreated, the varieties I grow just keep losing leaves until they
It is a pretty light usage. A pound of powder lasts me a couple
I doubt that modern hybrids would have any problem with it, but I'm
hooked on my Black Plum tomatoes. And my wife fully endorses the
resulting pasta sauce.
I am a magnet for invasive weeds that spread beneath the surface.
I used to believe that mulch could cure everything, but bermuda
grass and creeping thistle have convinced me otherwise. Still,
mulch makes it easier.
Drew Lawson | I told them we had learned to change
| our swordblades into plows.
that's what happens here too, but it is usually
late enough by the time the plants are done anyways.
perhaps planting more would work where you could
get the earliest crop and then just be done with
them before they get worse? the reason why we don't
go for other varieties is that we get between 20-40lbs
of fruit per plant so we get enough even with the
blight. it doesn't look pretty but i'm good with
how it goes.
i tried babying the grape vine one season with it
to see if it made any difference. decided that once
i found a major flaw in the plant to just remove the
vine instead of continuing the spraying. i still
have the copper sulphate granules on the shelf with
the few tablespoons removed from the package. being
someone who has a hard time throwing things away i
should get rid of it but haven't yet.
yeah, i understand that...
we have pretty hard clay soil for subsoil so
when the sow thistle gets going it can take
quite an effort to track it down to remove it.
the larger thistles aren't much fun either but
at least their roots are larger and easier to
find all the pieces.
mulch makes a lot of things easier. :) i
like how when the wood chips we use finally
break down they turn into the dark humus that
goes well in the veggie gardens. if i'm
lucky enough i can get enough to use in the
worm buckets as they'll recharge that and i
also mix in some garden soil to help give
the clay something more to bind to along with
all that organic matter. it makes for some
really nice fertilizer at the end of a year.
I read "Ruth Stout's No-Till Gardening" when I was about 13, and I
haven't been the same since.
The county yard waste place takes in brush/branches and grinds it
for free mulch. The only down side is that I have to load it myself.
Well, that and the fact that the garden is uphill from the driveway.
My garden has been going for about 12 years. When I was tilling
last year, I was pleasantly surprised at how dark and fluffy the
soil was. It started out as yellow clay, which is still what is
down under the reach of the tiller.
I really should get it tested this year. I have no idea what the
N/P/K condition is, just the texture.
Drew Lawson | We were taking a vote when
| the ground came up and hit us.
well of course! :) they didn't plan any of this
here and certainly would have been much better had
they brought in fill for where the gardens are at
now... too late now though.
i've never formally tested any of the gardens
here. how things grow can tell you a lot about
what you're lacking. when i first started out i
couldn't grow beets well at all and onions never
got very large. once i started adding the worm
compost the differences were pretty easy to see.
beets grew well, onions got bigger.
i'm now able to add some of the worm compost
to some of the poorest soil gardens i have and
i can see how that is helping the beans i normally
plant in there. the rows where i can get some
down the beans are darker and bigger and produce
if i were a little more dilligent about
chopping and using the green manure patch higher
nitrogen greens (alfalfa and birdsfoot trefoil)
i could make a lot more progress in that regards
too as those being chopped and left on the
green manure patch has really improved the soil
back there. it's sweet. :)
which isn't ever going to happen... especially
considering it would likely come back for various
even if we have a lot of clay it has taken me
a long time to get the garden soil in some of the
patches to be fairly decent. i'm surely not going
to be removing it. also considering i don't have
any easy way to move it around other than a
wheel barrow or bucket at a time.
i can live with it as it is. :)
Well, when I look back on how dismal my results were, I
am a bit shocked that I have gotten to successful now that
I have had to cut back by 1/2 this next year on what I plant
because I can't physically keep up with it. My freezer is
still packed with frozen vegis that I wonder if I will have
eaten before my new crop comes it.
Last year what the first year I gave away produce. It was
a proud moment and a rite of passage of sorts.
Water cost was never really an issue as I use a watering
wand and only spot water.
As far a ground cover goes, I have yet to get purslane to
cover the open spaces. Right now, my whole back yard is
green with weeds, mostly the grass that would not grow when
it was a lawn and some wild carrot. I have a bunch of
vinegar waiting to spray everything, but it keeps raining
and snowing and vinegar won't work until the ground dries
My list for the garden this year:
Row 1, 10 Holes:
6 anaheim peppers (1 per hole). Note: Blossom Rot !!!!!
Row 2, 12 holes
3 golden zukes
Row 3, 7 holes:
Scallions (green onions)
3 cherries x - x - x (sweet 100's only)
4x cherries (sweet 100's only)
Also may try "a" traditional pumpkin
Add to that, I am still trying to get billberries,
Arapaho black berries, and choke berries (not cherries)
to grow. My Goji's are loving all the attention and
if last year is any indications, I am going to be
inundated with them.
I think the biggest lesson I had to learn was that I
had to grow/nurture the soil first before expecting
to get any results from things growing in it. Soil
is actually alive.
You do realize you had a lot to do with this? Thank you!
You do realize these plants have made slaves out of us!
good to hear! :) i am contemplating not planting
red peppers this year because i have so many jars
still in the freezer from last year. i need to start
eating them more often, but my problem is that i
just forget they are up there to begin with. i'm
not usually someone who eats from the freezer that
often. i hardly ever even open it.
i hope you never get invaded by some of the troublesome
weeds that have shown up here. the only consolation i
get from them is that they end up being free worm food
hard to keep up with some plants watering them when it
gets so hot outside. the only thing i can think of that
may help there is making a much larger hole and putting
the plant roots down deeper. of course balancing the pH
will help some too, but it's not an easy thing to do when
you have tough alkaline soils to begin with.
i could never eat enough from a single plant let
alone three of them!
i tried to read up on Goji's and i wasn't sure i
would like them from the description so i haven't
pressed it further.
you have to start somewhere. any free organic
materials are better than nothing.
y.w.! :) i'm glad things are going well for you
and you keep on learning more. that's about all you
can do - always interesting to try new things and to
see what might happen.
we're all in this together. life supports life.
I wonder about pronouncements from this activist group. This is first
opinion of what others think:
As a long retired chemist I am amazed at improvements in analytic
chemistry to now find materials down to parts per trillion. Also as a
chemist I know that toxicity is dose related and presence of a
contaminant does not necessarily mean it can harm you.
As for kale, I knew nothing about it but noted today it was part of a
store mixed salad I had for lunch. By itself it would not be a good
salad but the mix was very tasty. I read that kale is loaded with
vitamins but when I was on Coumadin I would have avoided it for high
vitamin K content.
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