Treated lumber for bird house

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so that one flew over a Mensa's head!
dave
Doug Miller wrote:

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Tue, Jun 8, 2004, 10:46pm (EDT+4) snipped-for-privacy@wildcatpub.org burbled: I doubt any of my neighbors have to be worried about being killed in their beds by my Bostick 15 gauge nailer.
Possibly not. Just drive-bys, by drug dealers, with illegal guns.
JOAT You know it's gonna be a bad day, when you turn on the news and they're showing escape routes out of the city.
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Doug Miller wrote:

No the finishing nails are fine. The pliers however need to be equipped with a safety device so only _qualified_ plier uses can operate them. They also need to be equipped with a device to limit brad nipping capability to no larger than 18 gage.
-Bruce

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Quite correct. A legal system that returns violent felons to the streets, while incarcerating non-violent voluntary users of mind-altering chemicals, might have something to do with that, do ya think?
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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In article <pmkierst-
snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.spam.off.com says...

A voice of reason. Thank you.
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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wrote:

I love this one. LAKEWOOD - A 36-year-old Lakewood man was killed Wednesday while trying to teach his 13-year-old son about gun safety, police say.
Investigators say the man was trying to show his son how to deal with intruders when the gun went off at their home in the 100 block of South Kendall Street around 3:45 p.m.
A bullet struck the man in his head. He died at St. Anthony's Hospital a short time later.
No names have been released.
Police said the teen thought the gun was unloaded when it went off. At this time, police have not decided if they will file charges against him.
------- What this report fails to include is that the guys two daughters aged 10 and 7 were in the room at the time as well. The moron was teaching them how to do a quick draw from under his bed pillow. I wonder if the shooter inherited the guns.<g>
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that report ALSO makes me wonder if it was truly accidental. While this particular incident was most likely an accident, how do you PROVE conclusively that someone was killed accidentally as opposed to "accidentally on purpose"? Perry Mason could figure it out, but how about real life detectives?
dave
snipped-for-privacy@wildcatpub.org wrote:

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On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 20:42:10 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@wildcatpub.org

Glad you find humor in a dumbass's death. Very compassionate of you.

I'd say he taught his kids about gun safety all right - as a counterexample. Is there a point in this, or are you just sharing an amusing anecdote with us?
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Apparently you didn't find it worth noting that the majority of those are _suicides_.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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Dave,
Very easy to disprove the old "Every Fourteen Minutes" bit, or even worse the 50,000+ bit with simple math. Most people tend to believe what they believe rather than think.
Simple way to look at it is by examining with facts and make your own assumption.
Say we believed the 14 minute bit, than the following states would have the following gunshot deaths.
Okalahoma 449 per year or 1.23 a day Virginia 939 per year or 2.57 a day.
Now if you live in those states watch you local news and you should expect to hear about the same amount of deaths reported per day for the ENTIRE year . This is of course under the assumption that a "gunshot" death is news worthy. LOL
Now if we use the 50,000 per year number we come up with :
Minnesota 869 per year or 2.38 per day Florida 2,904 per year or 7.95 per day
Somebody in FL please watch the late news and report how many gunshot victims are in the news tonight.
Since in fact nobody can come up with an accurate source for these bogus Gunshot numbers, it is a lot easier to disprove it using simple factual math. I can only assume that the people who believe these numbers, are bad at math, and are the same people you see standing in line at the lottery.
Roger L
wrote:

world who

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Nobody? Don't any of you have google? It takes about 2 minutes to cough up the CDC web site and you can run numbers all day long. The system allows you enough flexibility so that I am sure that you could support almost any theory you wanted to, so long as you do it on line without critical thinking.
Example stat it took me less then 1 minute to generate:
2001 Homicides, not including "legal intervention", from firearms: 11,348
All age groups, all races. Not 50,000. Does that make it good or bad? You be the judge. But don't claim that nobody can come up with an accurate source. If they don't, it is because they don't want to. And that goes for all sides of the argument.
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Citation, please?

Let's have some facts here, shall we, instead of just repeating bullshit that you read somewhere?
Source for the following is the 2003 World Almanac and Book of Facts (World Almanac Books, New York), pages 76- 80.
In 1999 [latest year this almanac provides statistics for], there were 28,874 total deaths involving firearms in the United States. Of these, the majority were suicide (16,599). Approximately three out of eight were homicides (10,828). Another 824 were accidents, and in 324 cases "the intention involved (whether accident, suicide, or homicide) could not be determined."
One year contains 525,600 minutes. Therefore, the rate of firearm deaths from all causes in the US in 1999 was one every eighteen minutes -- and a firearm *homicide* occurred, on average, once every 49 minutes.
For comparison purposes, in the same year, 42,401 people died in motor vehicle accidents, and more people died of falls (13,162) and poisoning (12,186) than died of firearm homicides -- and one-point-five *million* people die of cancer, heart disease, and stroke every year.
For those who are unduly concerned about firearm _accidents_, please note that more people drowned (3,529), choked (3,885), suffocated (1,618) or died in fires (3,348), than died in firearm accidents (824, as noted above).

Translation: you don't have any facts to back up your claims.

Wrong again. That group is called "liberals". One symptom of their illness is the delusion that laws, in and of themselves, actually have any effect on the behavior of the criminal class, a group which _by_definition_ does not obey laws. This most frequently manifests itself as the delusional belief that legislation restricting the use or possession of firearms can in any way reduce the crime rate, despite massive evidence to the contrary.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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Tue, Jun 8, 2004, 10:12pm (EDT+4) snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (DougMiller) asks: Citation, please? <snip of a whole bunch of good stuff>
Way to go, Doug!
JOAT You know it's gonna be a bad day, when you turn on the news and they're showing escape routes out of the city.
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snipped-for-privacy@gun.nut says...

I never thought I'd be defending Dave, but I am :-).
I grew up in an era and place where eveyone had guns. Kids even brought them to school so they could go hunting on the way home. While there were people who misused them, most of the people who got shot deserved it.
The rule was never, never point a gun at someone (or something) unless you intend to pull the trigger.
If you were a kid stealing watermelons or corn, you got rock salt.
If you were an adult doing the same, you got birdshot or rabbit shot.
If you broke into a house, you got a .38 or .45 slug or a hunting bullet.
The problem isn't the guns, it's the breakdown of society.
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 19:39:17 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@gun.nut calmly ranted:

Right, we won't lie like you.
Forget "what someone said." If you want to be really informed, I suggest that everyone read John Lott's "More Guns, Less Crime" and Kleck/Kates' "Armed: New Perspectives on Gun Control" (2001) then make up their own minds. Research all their claims and you'll find them true, and that it's a small group of gun control bigots (similar to what the Moral Majority is doing in their realm) who have somehow found a way to get their false minority views into the public spotlight despite their deceptions and illogic.
If you rule out gangs killing one another, DOCTORS kill more people than guns do each year, as do automobiles and accidents.
Medical Errors - A Leading Cause of Death The JOURNAL of the AMERICAN MEDICAL ASSOCIATION (JAMA) Vol 284, No 4, July 26th 2000 article written by Dr Barbara Starfield, MD, MPH, of the Johns Hopkins School of Hygiene and Public Health, shows that medical errors may be the third leading cause of death in the United States.
The report apparently shows there are 2,000 deaths/year from unnecessary surgery; 7000 deaths/year from medication errors in hospitals; 20,000 deaths/year from other errors in hospitals; 80,000 deaths/year from infections in hospitals; 106,000 deaths/year from non-error, adverse effects of medications - these total up to 225,000 deaths per year in the US from iatrogenic causes which ranks these deaths as the # 3 killer. Iatrogenic is a term used when a patient dies as a direct result of treatments by a physician, whether it is from misdiagnosis of the ailment or from adverse drug reactions used to treat the illness. (drug reactions are the most common cause).
According to a 2003 update, it's up to 3/4 of a million deaths. http://tinyurl.com/u2jt
Guns were used in 70% of the 24k murders in the country in 1995. That's 17k, less than half the number your "death every 14 minutes" stats. Maybe you're counting suicides, too? http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/guic.pdf
You might wish to lose the emotions and actually -read- some of the many valid books and papers on the subject. They'll open your eyes.
------------------------------------------------------- "i" before "e", except after "c", what a weird society. ---- http://diversify.com Dynamic Website Applications
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wrote:

When is the last time a gun did life saving surgery or drove you to work. When is the last time a bullet did anything but kill or maim? Bullets have killed or maimed a quarter million american already this century. Every one of those bullets did exactly what it was designed to do. A bullet has no other purpose. Why Do americans enjoy killing and maiming each other with guns? That's the question that must be answered. We know it's a mental illness, but can it be cured.
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wrote:

Guns save lives, too, every time they are used for self-defense.

Statistics, please -- particularly as regards your use of the word "maimed".
Don't forget to check the statistics on the number of people killed or maimed by motor vehicles.

False, and you know it. It has already been explained to you that bullets are also used in target shooting. Are you unaware that shooting is, and has been for many years, an Olympic sport?

We don't. Where did you get the idea that we do? For heaven's sake, man, turn off your damned television set and interact with the real world. Try reading the books that were suggested in another post -- you might actually learn something new.

No, the question that must be answered is why you have these irrational, delusional beliefs.

And I hope that someday you find your cure.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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On Wed, 09 Jun 2004 03:11:45 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:

This thread pertains to handguns and assault rifles. I have no problem with guns designed for target shooting or sport shooting. I've never heard of a kid taking his dads target rifle to school to shoot another child or teacher. I'm sure the kids at Columbine weren't packing System Gemini TR 701s.
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Oh, great. You're a Michael Moore fan too. It figures.
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Purpose-built high-accuracy target weapons are outside the normal person's price, maintenance, and service range. The vast majority of guns used only for target practice in the US are common rifles and handguns. If guns owners only bought (and were able to) Olympic target handguns and rifles, then those would be the types stolen or bought for crimes. They're usually semi-autos and of the same .22S or .22LR calibers used in the most prolific handguns and rifles.
GTO(John)
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