Grizzly Japanese Chisels

[AArDvarK]

Has anyone seen these? Any opinions on the quality of laminated steel? I can see close-up they have hollowed backs, are they worth buying for at least a learning stage?

all,

Alex

[Never Enough Money]

I haven't used those chisels but I think they're pretty good. For a wider selection of Japanese chisels go to

and click till you get to chisels. They have chisels from cheap to don't-tell-the-wife.

Lie-Nielson

recently offered a set of chisels 4 chisels for about $250, if I remeber correctly). The chisels are not yet listed on their web page - I guess you can call them. I think they're stil getting their production line running but everything I've ever bought from LN is perfect -- I expect their chisels will be too.

Lee Valley also has some chisels:

all cases, some of the chisels are so close in performance that it's difficult to take sides. Apply the rule: you get what you pay for. I bought a set from Lee Valley and find that I only use two of them. If I had it to do over, I'd buy 2 medium priced Japanese chisels (1/4 inch and 3/8 inch)

two mortise chisels

[B a r r y]

I recently picked up some Hirsch chisels from Lee Valley. I don't have a ton of time on them yet, but I've been happy with them so far. The chisels took about 6-8 minutes each with Scary Sharp to flatten the backs and put on an initial edge, and it seems that the edge lasts much longer than my Blue Chips.

Barry

[RB]

Look here: They are nice. It was worth the wait.

RB

[AArDvarK]

Is this a scary sharp system?

for your reply,

Alex

[AArDvarK]

[Charlie Self]

AArDvarK asks:

locally at a lower price. The paper appears to be a fair-to-good deal, already cut. And I like that particular little non-complicated sharpening guide. If you want a trial package for yourself, it should owrk decently. But check both Lee Valley and McFeely's first for their renditions of SS.

Charlie Self "Wars spring from unseen and generally insignificant causes, the first outbreak being often but an explosion of anger." Thucydides

[B a r r y]

Yes, although many have put one together with found items. I dispensed with the glass and use my jointer bed, others use granite tiles.

The Rockler set up is a quick and easy way to get started, but a tad expensive.

Barry

[AArDvarK]

Yeah that's the first thing I thought, too much. There is a glass business within walking distance. I could get a thicker peice. And everything else at the HIC, thanks. Alex

[AArDvarK]

Great reply, I havr seen all those sites and more except the japanwoodworker.com one, they have the same chisels as Grizzly, as their own name brand. But like I said I need to spend less for as good as possible, those basic ones seem good for that but I don't understand about this "method" they talk about with softer steel laminated with harder steel, then the backs are hollowed. With that wouldn't the sharpening- over-time run into the hollowing? But with these and their level of RC hardening they seem to be the right price, would you trust them?

Alex

[AArDvarK]

Okay thanks, good advise. Alex

[Charlie Self]

AArDvarK asks:

You might well run into the hollows on the backs, but you're going to be so old and decrepit it won't matter.

If you're asking if Japan Woodworker can be trusted, the answer is yes.

Charlie Self "For NASA, space is still a high priority." Dan Quayle

[AArDvarK]

No I meant the chisels, but thanks very much on the advise. I'll probably get the Grizzly's or JWW ones depending on either companies politics of business, shipping costs and warrentees.

Alex

[Never Enough Money]

There are some tradeoffs between the hardness of steel and it's brittleness. The Japanese solved this problem by making a thin layer of very hard steel (which is brittle) and backing that up with a less hard and less brittle backing. That's why they have two main layers. They also use a forging technique which applies thin layers on top of thin layers. It's an old technique but supposedly very good -- and labor intensive.

The non-Japanese chisel makers have tried to find a single steel that has the optimum hardness-brittleness characteristics.

Some of the knowledgeable chisle folks in thius group might be able to elaborate (or correct me if I'm wrong..)

I once read why they have hollow backs but don't remember -- seems like it had something to do with faster flattening....

[AArDvarK]

It sounds like the technique is based upon samurai sword making with it's iron/steel folding-to-layers techniques, which does increase strength superlatively. These less costly chisels are probably a very minor excersize of the same ideal, they should work well. You can see in the pictures at either link that they are hollowed backs. I think I means that over time, with use of a mallet, the hollows will actually flatten more and more toward the convex direction, and then easily controlled by keeping them flat (I imagine).

Alex

[RB]

JWW is ok. I ordered from them earlier this year. There was an error in their processing of the order but they made it right quickly and at their expense.

RB

AArDvarK wrote:

[Bob Stewart]

[David E. Penner]

SNIP

I've found that using slightly steeper angles on my Japanese chisels prevents chipping (Leonard Lee's sharpening book discusses this issue).

David

[Fred the Red Shirt]

I've got that sharpening guide, or one just like it (made by General?) IMHO the Veritas is simpler and better. I had some trouble firmly clamping the blade with other and you you can also use the Veritas for skewed blades. The Veritas angle guide is nice too.

[AArDvarK]

You guys mean chipping as in chips out of the metal??? Now that would be an outrage! No way do I want that!

Alex