Building a new shop: 'Shed' or garage?

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snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (Mike Reed) wrote in message

Heck, even best case senerio I could only get two cars in the garage. With my truck, my wife's van, my son's car and my daughters car, all I would accomplish is hiding two of them. Then I would never get them out because the remaining two would be blocking them in. I have a nice concrete two lane driveway that could easily hold 8 or more cars. My family's cars are reasonably late model (1999 to 2002) and not on blocks. I admit I don't care if the neighbors would prefer all cars to be hidden. Lastly as I said earlier it is seldom sunny in Pittsburgh so UV isn't a concern - chipping off ice can be though ;)
Dave Hall
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Plan ahead, you children's cars won't be around forever. Take that into consideration for whatever that is worth.
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Not much to me as I still won't allow a car into my house - hell I won't even let the cat in the house. :)
Dave Hall
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Our garage is detached ;) While you won't allow a car into your house, I didn't want a garage on my house...
snipped-for-privacy@cs.com (David Hall) wrote in message

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snipped-for-privacy@nhsd.k2.pa.us (David Hall) wrote in message

Yeah, our kids are < 2 right now, so I expect to have my priorities shift in the coming years...

I don't see how keeping 4 in the driveway is any easier to manage than 2 in the garage and 2 in the driveway. The back two are still the first out ;)

That's a myth. Clouds block a lot of IR radiation, but not much of the UV, depending on the type of cloud. Most of the time they just scatter the UV. You can get a bad sunburn in cloudy weather, but most people are covered up since the blocked IR makes it cooler.
-Mike
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snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (Mike Reed) wrote in message

Depends on how you line them up and stagger them (ya get kinda scientific about it after so many times getting up on a cold morning and having to shuffle 3 cars to get out of the driveway). Also, since the garage is 90 degrees to the driveway, there has to be "backing out" room left in the driveway.

I have been in Arizon and the hottest, sunniest day in August in Pittsburgh does not have the solar intensity of a cloudy day in March in Phoenix. I can't remember the last time I saw someone put one of those cardboard sun reflectors on their dashboard in Pittsburgh - I never have - but I have never seen seriously cracked or faded dashes on cars under 10 years old here either. That just ain't the case in AZ. So, I guess I might house my car if I lived in AZ or at least add a carport to the driveway.
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decide
on
junk
hold
You can pick up a lot of additional natural light: http://solatube.com/home.htm
These collect a lot of sunlight and funnel it down from your roof. Far more effective than skylights.
Getting power, heat, etc. out to a shed is a big pain and not DIY. Bill
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On 9 Feb 2004 15:06:51 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Joshua) wrote:

Any chance that you could expand your exsisting garage outward ...or backward.... ? That way you could use the garage as a garage/shop or just banish the cars entirely and have a 19 by 35-40 foot shop...
I have a 20x40 foot garage and I have a 2 story 24x24 foot garage with my woodshop now located UPSTAIRS... NOT good...buy workable... ( I restore cars as a second hobby) ..
Bob Griffiths
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Bob G. wrote:

What kind of cars??
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On 9 Feb 2004 15:06:51 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Joshua) scribbled:

This is a plus, not a minus. Like Charlie Self says, cars belong outside, that's why they're painted so well. Note that I live in the Yukon. Two weeks ago, at a temperature of -45C (-49F) I had to use a propane tiger torch to get the car started. I still wouldn't put it in the garage.

Highly unlikely, breakers for 240 take the same space as two breakers for 110.

Sound proofing may be needed. Can you hear your cars or the garage door opening now?

Not critical.

And how often do you work on your lawn? How many seconds will you have to waste bringing it to the front?

So could your garage.

The only real advantage. But you could still build a shed to store stuff (woodworking of course).

OK
Why?
That's pretty small for the usual complement of stationary tools: TS, planer, jointer, BS, DP, lathe.

Big bucks

PITA
Wood floor seems to be the consensus. Wood floor on slab is prolly the easiest.

Yes, if the temperature inside the shed (actually the tools' temperature) is cooler than outside temperature when there is high humidity outside. True anywhere.

You are most welcome.
Luigi Replace "nonet" with "yukonomics" for real email address
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Josh:
First off, good luck on this. I am in the process of building my first true workshop and enjoyed the process. It's part of our brand new house, so it was easy to attach the workshop next to the garage, something to consider for yourself? I plan to use the garage for lumber storage and perhaps assembly. My new shop will has a flat, even with with the grade, floor, so I can roll out into the driveway, if needed. I live in No. Calif. (above the Golder Gate) and we have moderate temps all year. My shop will be under 325 sq feet, and I was hoping for me, but I can live with it.
Suggestions that I've read that helped me is to figure out what you need as far as tools and then work around that, allowing for growth. My sense is that storage becomes a big issue later on as you acquire more lumber. Get yourself some grid paper and sketch things out. Wood Magazine had a whole set of articles on building workshops and it was filled with good tips including a sheet that you can photocopy or scan with templates for tools. You'll see how quickly 200sqft can fill up!
Oh, as far as going through the permit process? It doesn't have to be a pain. The biggest thing is of course, is the added taxes that it could bring and here in Calif. the fees beyond the permit fee itself can be high.
MJ Wallace
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Thanks to everyone for all the tips and advice. I am currently checking into what it would cost me to build a ~400 sq.ft. external workshop. If the price is in my range (including getting the electrical hookup!), that's how I will go. Otherwise, I think I'll just get creative with the garage ;)
One more question for the group: For those of you with dedicated shops with wood floors, do you know how the wood floor is constructed? Is it like a standard subfloor (e.g., plywood over joists)? Is it built directly on a slab or is it raised like a conventional floor?
Thanks once again!
- Josh
snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Joshua) wrote in message

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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Joshua) wrote in message

Mine's plywood, on joists, on skids, on the ground. No problems with that, and it's comfortable to stand on all day.
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As a rule, does a shop on joists/skids need a building permit as compared to an in ground slab of concrete? Or does it depend on individual zoning variances and building size, .etc?
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wrote:

consult your local code.
in a lot of places, if it is under 200 sq ft or so and doesn't have a foundation it doesn't need a permit.
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"Details" _always_ vary by local jurisdiction. The only way to know for sure what's "legal" in _your_ territory is to: (a) read all the laws yourself, or (b) ask somebody 'official', who know -- like the building inspector. Note: no matter what _you_ *think* the law says, what the =inspector= thinks it says is what governs. :)
*Almost* invariably, a 'permanent structure' requires a building permit.
"small" out-buildings -- like those 6'x6' up to 8'x12' or so, "sheds" that Sears, and the various BORG, sell in kit form -- are _usually_ exempt. As is a doghouse (to carry things to extremes :).
"Movable" things don't require a _building_ permit. Makes a pair of low-frame moving trailers -- parked 'intimately' side-by-side, with the adjacent doors opened, and the join gasketed -- an "interesting" concept. circa 500 sq ft At the low-floor level, and lots of storage over the wheels at each end. Or the semi-trailer type known as an 'expand-a-van').
Caveat: other restrictions -- zoning, etc. -- may apply.
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**--__''""()...
did I leave any out, Robert? :)
(I'm just messin' with ya!)
dave
Robert Bonomi wrote:

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I'll be sure and let you know, *IF* you succeed. <snicker>

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