Best Glue

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Being both a novice woodworker and new to this group, I hope you can give me some advice on the best exterior wood glue. I'm making an outdoor project of treated pine lumber that will be above ground, but exposed to the elements. Because I live in the deep south the project will be exposed to almost daily rains, extreme heat, and sun.
What do y'all recommend?
Cooniedog
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wrote:

What are you making? Metal fasteners may be better than glue for some applications.
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Jim Behning wrote:

Planters with routed out framing and legs to hold flat panel inserts for the sides.
Cooniedog
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No adhesive on the panels. Screws for the framing and legs. Jim
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Because of the initial high moisture content, and the cycling of stresses, I'll suggest that the very best adhesive might succeed only in tearing the wood apart, where the glued surface is more tightly bonded than the surrounding layers of wood.
Wood changes dimension, depending on species and orientation relative to grain, very much in response to moisture changes. If you can isolate it from this, like with paint, shading, internal ventilation, whatever, you might have a chance, depending on joint used and grain orientation.
I'd pass on glue, while maybe trying some experiments on small pieces, with epoxy, urethane, yellow glues. Pay attention to grain orientation at joints- dimension changes are almost entirely in the plane perpendicular to the axis.
Depending on the treatment used on the wood, your only choice may be stainless-steel fasteners. Many fasteners fail rapidly with current (non-cca) treatment.
J
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Thu, Aug 30, 2007, 7:55am (EDT-1) snipped-for-privacy@cox.net (Cooniedog) doth sayeth: <snip> the project will be exposed to almost daily rains, extreme heat, and sun. What do y'all recommend?
Move.
JOAT What is life without challenge and a constant stream of new humiliations? - Peter Egan
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J T wrote:

Great idea, but I got too much invested in This Old House after Hurricane Katrina to go anywhere but the "Poor House."
Dawg
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Tite bond 2 for most projects, Poly when I need it to be waterproof, E-6000 for multimedia glue ups or non wood glue ups. For treated wood metal fastners. Do very little with treated wood and don't know a lot about it.
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Cooniedog, Ordinarily, Titebond III is considered an excellent choice for outdoor use. BUT, water-based glues don't work well with treated lumber because the wood won't soak up the glue. I'd use a polyurethane glue such as Gorilla Glue if it's outdoor furniture you're building. Liquid Nails makes a construction adhesive specifically for treated lumber. I'd use that if it's for a carpentry type project. But in either case I'd still use mechanical fasteners too. Stainless steel screws if you can get them locally (Home Depot carries some about 1.5 inches long). Deck screws if you can't find stainless. Treated wood EATS uncoated screws. Treated wood usually is soaking wet when you get it. Some of it will splatter when you hit it with a hammer. Use it quickly, before it has a chance to warp. Fasten it securely so it will resist warping as it dries. Allow it to dry in the shade if possible. When the sun draws moisture from the top of the board so much faster than the bottom, ugly things happen sometimes.
DonkeyHody "There's a heap o' difference between doing things right and doing the right things."
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RE: Subject
After epoxy, it's all down hill.
Lew
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Cooniedog wrote:

Treated pine doesn't glue well and an outdoor piece is going to require really careful design so that wood movement doesn't tear apart the joints.
You'll find that the mechanical hardware for building decks is designed specifically to allow a certain amount of movement.
For joints where the grain on both pieces is going in the same direction I'd go with an epoxy or resorcinol glue. Where the grain crosses best bet IMO would be to make the joint with a little clearance and use a polyurethane caulk instead of a conventional glue--the caulk's flexible enough that it will give a little when the wood moves, but the downside is that unless you're really careful with the joint design the piece is going to seem wobbly all the time, and the joint will never be as strong as a conventionally glued joint.
--
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--John
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wrote:

The PT pine must be dry to use Waterproof woodworkers glue. I use Elmers Exterior glue and it has been working well so far--holding together outdoors (in e. TN) for over 16 years. Drying PT wood takes time--I like to dry it in the basement for several months. Despite clamps, some pieces will split, warp, crack, wane and bow. If you can find some dry PT wood, all the better. Dry wood glues up and finishes well. A good finish and a little maintenance will extend the life of an outdoor project.
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FIY I have been enjoying kiln dried PT lumber for a year or so. Its price is marginally more expensive than the wet stuff from the same supplier. In addition to the lumber being straighter and less prone to warp it is also consistently lighter in weight.
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Are there any other sources for the kiln-dried besides Stahlman's?
--
Dave in Houston



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Man Dave, you nailed that one right square on the head. Would they be the only one's? Maybe Montabano and or Bison.
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As you know, Montalbano won't let you pick your material and so it's common occurrence to get stuck with more than your fair share of twisted, warped, and bowed (not to mention BIG ugly knots) material. And Bison. Let's just say I'd rather have my chest cracked than deal with Bison (though you know I DO deal with them when I absolutely, positively HAVE TO match a piece of molding). How many times have you taken 10 or 15 minutes to purchase at Bison and then wait 30-40-50 minutes for them to bring you the wrong stuff? But, hey! Their new website is a big improvement! http://www.bisonbuilding.com / Hmmm, I'm not sure Detering has treated lumber; composite maybe? I'm OK with Stahlman's. They actually have No.1 treated (kiln-dried!). And they let you drive your truck right back there in the sheds and pick out your boards. You can't beat that.
--
Dave in Houston



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Which Stahlman's do you buy from? I buy in Stafford, I live about 4 miles from that store. I actually choose Stahlman's quite often when buying construction grade material. I prefer to only handle the material one time rather than pick it and put it on the cart, then load it on the truck, then unload at the job site. Stahlman's eliminates the first 2 steps. I generally buy more than needed and do the picking and choosing at the job site. I return the overages and they seem to prefer that rather than helping me pick and choose.
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That's convenient for you and a welcome opportunity [I would imagine] to avoid LeGrande Orange. As I am right at Beltway 8 and 290 I use the 59 and Greenbriar location when and if. Depends sometimes where the job location is.
--
Dave in Houston



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For outdoor projects like yours I always go with resorcinol. That's one glue that seems simply not affected by conditions once it has set.
-P.
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I used Gorilla Glue with PT wood last year. I built three decks. I glued and screwed mitered corners of the handrails, steps and a few other spots. The decks have survived a Manitoba winter -40 deg and + 100 Deg. F this summer along with more rain than I've seen in years. No failures (yet).
Picture of deck at link below. Click on cabin 4.
http://www.mts.net/~lmlod/index.html
Cooniedog wrote:

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