Somewhat OT - Broadband Specification

[thescullster]

Hi all

Yes we're back in Hull with Kingston Communications broadband offerings.

I have taken up the service of KC Lightstream which is essentially a fibre based broadband offering. I say "fibre based" because in our locality, this is fibre to the cabinet rather than fibre to the home, so the last 300m (in my case) is the existing copper phone line.

Their avertising web literature (under FAQs) states:

"Where we?re installing Fibre To The Cabinet (FTTC), or Fibre To The Basement (FTTB) in the case of blocks of flats, we?ll provide guaranteed speeds of between 40Mbps and 80Mbps ? still lightning fast, but the speeds will vary from property to property because the final part of the connection is delivered using copper cables."

My interpretation of this statement was that each property will receive a broadband service with an individual speed guaranteed based on measurement by the install guy - this speed falling between 40 and 80 Mbps. The install guy did measure the line speed and quoted 2 figures (IIRC) 79Mbps and 119Mbps - not sure what each meant and he didn't explain clearly. Anyone know the significance of the two values?

Their interpretation is that they simply guarantee that the service will fall somewhere between those limits, which clearly allows the service to be variable.

So I am currently paying for the 75Mbps service with no guarantee that I will actually be receiving anything over 40Mbps. To be honest, the speed is fine and the reason for choosing this service was for the 700Gb download as much as the speed, but I don't think that's relevant here.

How do others read the FAQ statement above please?

Phil

[Dave Liquorice]

VDSL (the method of getting the 'net to you from the cabinet) has two basic forms one maxes out at around 38 Mbps the other around 76 Mbps. At 300 m you should get pretty much the full whack of VDSL2, ie close to 76 Mbps. Much further and the rate starts to drop likea stone, 600 m 50 Mbps,

900 m 30 Mbps, 1200m and there is very little difference between VDSL and ADSL2+ 22 Mbps.

[Andy Burns]

If only someone at BT knew that :-(

I live on a group of four streets, where the houses range from 50m to

400m from the old cabinet, the nearest shiny new FTTC cabinet is about 50m from it.

You could practically guarantee 9/10 of the houses would snap BT's arms off to get anything faster than the current 2-3Mbps, but they don't consider it worthwhile to install a tie-cable between the cabinets.

[thescullster]

Thanks Dave and Andy

The question hinges on how they have worded the guarantee (see original post). I read this as a specific measured figure being guaranteed; KC's droid and his upline simply claimed it was simply any service between 40 and

75Mbps.

Phil

[Andy Burns]

I don't know how KC work, but BT establish the line's maximum stable rate (MSR) during the first 10 days of service, they then set a fault threshold rate (FTR) as 70% of MSR, and won't accept a callout for being slow unless speed is below the FTR.

In practice you get what the line can give.

[Dave Liquorice]

between

You think droids and their managers have a faintest idea of what the kit can and does do? At best it'll third hand marketing puff.

That's the case for ADSL, does it also apply to VDSL?

In a nutshell.

[Vir Campestris]

Pooh.

We've got FTTC being rolled out. The cabinet is 880 metres from the nearest house, and 1250 from ours :(

Ah well, 22 is better than 4.5!

Andy

[Bob Eager]

Cabinet in our case is about 1200 metres. After a week some OR person disconnected us by mistake. The 'repaired' line had a much slower speed. After 3 visits it's back to about 70% of the original.

Next door (terrace of three houses) they are on a different pole and a cabinet 200 metres away. Spit.

[Dave Liquorice]

Remember that the ADSL will be coming from the exchange not the cabinet, could be a very diiferent distance. Which with 4.5 currently on ADSL is obviously the case, exchange line about 3.7 km?

This is another gotcha. Though if that pole is on the same exchange and has spare pairs and there are spares in the exchnage line cable passing the cabinet it ought to be possible to alter the jumpering in the exchange, patch you across to the other pole and thus get you full whack VDSL. How you kick BT into doing this I don't know, might have to pay for the "extra works".

At least you have a possibly viable option. The 24 fibre cable that will feed the cabinet down in the village 2km further away from the exchange runs past or place in a duct under our forecourt. Our exchange line (3.1 km around 6 Mbps ADSL2 (not 2+) goes straight back to the exchange along a different route. If they could get the exchnage line into the cable that passes the cabinet it would add 4 km to it, over old and unreliable cabling, not to mention running a pair "backwards" and having to get from the chamber outside our place into the building. I suspect the POTS would be off more than on and hardly useable due to line loss over 7 km. At 2 km VDSL is around 15 Mbps on a good line, hardly worth it.

How ever the "good news" is that 200 m away in the direction of the exchange there is going to be a fibre "node", ie a jointing point for the fibre cable. Small duct through the exsisting 4" ducting to the chamber right by our place, 20 yds of trench across our car park, and we have FTTP. I expect that even that little bit of work will still cost and arm and leg even if we dig/fill/make good the trench. I'd also have to look hard at the service levels available on FTTP, can you get Total Care at £4.00/month inc VAT?

[Dave Liquorice]

Get together and see if you can grab some of the £2.8 million(?) avialable as "Community Build" under the BDUK umbrella.

[Andy Burns]

I'd thought about the idea, the county council were claiming we'd be included in their scheme sometime in 2014, I think that's slipped to

2016, you could bet that if you showed signs of developing a community scheme BT would suddenly decide to dig 50m of trench after all ...

[Dave Liquorice]

I thought HMG's target date for 90% "Superfast" broadband (>24 Mbps download) was end 2015...

Not a community scheme as in a group being an ISP/infrastruture owner/operator but a group getting that money together to get BT to do a bit more than they need to under the main BDUK funding/contract with the council. At least I *think* that is what the intention of the £250 million Superfast Extension Project (SEP) is. To extend the

90% to 95% by end 2017.

Don't confuse SEP with the Rural Community Broadband Fund, which IIRC is help for community ISP type organisations. All SEP has done for such community projects is to half pull the rug out from under them as they don't know if BT will now put in FTTC, the county may/may not provide funding, or something else.

[Vir Campestris]

I'm not sure exactly where the exchange is - but it's nearer 4.5km than 3.7.