floors in new house

[kellywatson]

We are having problems with our builder Redrow. We moved into our new home 16 months ago....

See following for more info

last remaining problem is our upstairs floor. The floor beams sit at different levels. This is cause to our unlevel floors and we cannot lay floor coverings.

Redrow has tried to repair the floors once and promised they would not bodge it to just within tolerance. Well that is exactly what they did. Our floors still do not meet the NHBC standards. Apparently the standards are not actually standards but guidelines. If there is going to be too much cost involved with fixing things to within standards then the NHBC does not force the builder to do so.

We have had professionals round to look at the floors and they have agreed that the floors are unsuitable for coverings and cannot believe the mess Redrow has left our floors in. It is going to cost us approx =A33000 to fix the problems by packing the floor boards. That is all our savings.

Is there something else we can do???

Since removing a floorboard last night we have discovered that Redrow have bodged the packing they carried out and there is random pieces of plastic and plywood over the beams and the floorboard in some places are not screwed into the beams just resting on it.

I am at a loss...

Kelly

[Rob Morley]

It seems to me that you could fix it yourselves for a lot less than that=20

- a LASER level, a drill/power driver, some screws, a load of packing=20 and something to cut it with is all that's required. Plus s load of=20 time and patience, of course.

[The3rd Earl Of Derby]

> Our last remaining problem is our upstairs floor. The floor beams sit

Have you tried bbc's 'Watchdog'? inform Redrow your going to do this and see what they say, give them a time limit to correct the problem with a successful repair but carry out your threat if they do not meet the deadline.

Benjamin Middlethwaite

[Rob Summers]

Does your house insurance have legal expenses cover? If so, I'd be asking them for their advice.

Rob

[kellywatson]

We have tried to contact watchdog but they are very selective about there stories. You get 40 secs to describe your problem. They say due to the number of calls they cannot follow up every story. We had a follow up story in the local press this week and a national newspaper consumer section is interested. I called redrow all day yesterday to tell them this and the person who can make the decisions is too busy to return our calls.

[kellywatson]

House insurance I am sure has legal cover.

However, we have already used the solicitor and Redrow just ignores anything we send them. They know that we do not have enough time money or sanity ( we have been living like this fighting for 16 months) to go through that process.

They have us cornered.

[The3rd Earl Of Derby]

Telephoning a company with a problem such as yours is not the way to go, it has to be via snail mail and in terms of proof corrospondance, telephoning is not one of them.

-- Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

[kellywatson]

That would mean a file the size of an epic novel. I am not sure they would bother to look into all that.. However, might be the only way to go really.

Thanks

[Rob Summers]

If your legal cover is still valid (it may not be now you've used another solicitor but your insurance company will be able to tell you) you should be using that. You really should be contacting your insurance company and getting their advice.

Cheers

Rob

[Chris Bacon]

Post to uk.legal.moderated, and ask what your chances are of a successful small claims procedure.

[meow2222]

lol

So now youre wise to the NHBC game.

Whoever quoted you that needs a kick where it hurts - unless your house is pretty big.

sounds exactly how its meant to be.

you only need 2 screws a board. Maybe youre not familiar with this one.

Could you spare =A3100 to do it? That should just cover it. It means you doing the work, but its not difficult.

Youve already seen how to do it, unscrew the floor boards, and pack them with assorted scrap to get the tops all level. Then rescrew the boards.

You'll need a load of wood scrap for packing - see your nearest skip, or get a bundle of free offcuts from your friendly diy shed. And youll need a few tools. Electric saw, to cut the packing. Electric screwdriver to unscrew and screw. Possibly more screws. And finally a level. A long spirit level is =A31 from poundland, but check it before buying, as some read right, some dont. Or get a small level and sit it on a longer piece of wood. Or use a laser level if you like.

Thats all it takes. DIY is really quite easy once you know what to do, and have been brave enough to give it a go. Just try not to stand on anything while the floors up lol. And be careful about treading on loose boards - stand on an unsupported end and it flips up, smacks you in the teeth, and dumpe you through the ceiling. Temporary boards can be (temporarily) screwed down to avoid this worry.

BTW, I'd be tempted to buy half inch chipboard and lay that onto the packing before putting your floorboards back. This will give you a large smooth flat surface, so any little errors in packing wont show up: it would probably save a lot of work.

Which electric screwdriver? go for fast charge, 2 or 3 batteries, and the higher v the better. Avoid junk brands.

Which saw? Probably the friendliest and cheapest for your job is toolstation.com's =A327 mitre saw. That wont cut chip sheet tho, if you do that you'll need a hand held circular saw. Any such will cut chip like butter.

BTW, if the height differences are only small, I'd forget packing altogether, and just put chipboard down then your nice floorboards on top.

Its not 'ard, and it certainly wont cost you 3 grand!

NT

[kellywatson]

Unfortunately I am not that great at DIY as I have not had much experience.

I am running out of time as the carpet place that is storing our carpets (and has been for 18 months) wants us to take our carpets away.

We have family coming at Christmas and nowhere to put them. Family that are storing our stuff are needing there space back again.

=A33000 is all the money we have for everything else we need in the house and doing the garden. It just seems like a heck of a lot of money!

[Chris Bacon]

A small claim procedure is quick, and cheap.

[Richard Conway]

Do you have a friend or relative who might be able to help you out? Even just for a few hours so you get the hang of the job?

Maybe you could strike a deal with the carpet place and your family. Sort the house room by room and assure them that each time you finish a room you'll take that carpet/furniture off their hands.

It is a hell of a lot of money, especially as its not your fault and isn't something you should be having to pay for anyway. You would save a lot of it if you did do it yourself though.

[Chris Bacon]

Thinking about it, if the builder won't act, you're going to have to pay for the work to be done. If you can get your independent expert to witness, then you can tell "Redrow" that you will fix it yourself, and send them the bill, with the threat of action to recover the money. Sorry, I don't know how the law might work WRT this in Scotland.

[Peter Taylor]

It's not quite that simple though. You need to find the highest point in each room and pack up to that level, and then worry about whether the levels in the doorways all meet up and what you're going to do about the top nosing on the stairs. Some of the joists might be too high in relation to the stairs, in which case there's nothing that can be done short of removing them.

For packing up, it would be easier to screw lengths of timber to the sides of the joists using a spirit level and straight-edge. They only need to be

25 x 50mm or so. Using loose scraps is exactly how Redrow tried to botch it and failed.

If the joists are so uneven, what are the ground floor ceilings like?

Kelly, why weren't all the faults picked up by the Mortgage Valuer when you bought the house? It doesn't sound like it was marketable (and therefore mortgageable) and I think it's a question you should put to them. I take it you didn't bother with a condition survey with a snagging list? This would at least have allowed you to withhold part of the payment until the snags had been sorted.

I'm sorry to hear all your woes. I hope you get it sorted out soon. Peter

[Rob Morley]

It's not a difficult job, although it may seem a bit intimidating. You=20 don't need to worry about finish - nobody will ever see the packing. =20 You can reuse the existing holes when refitting the boards - number the=20 boards so they go back in the same place. A LASER level makes setting=20 the levels very easy - if the projected beam is within a couple of=20 millimetres of the mark then your packing is the right thickness. All=20 you have to do is find the highest point on the floor joists and pack=20 everything else level with that. For packing pieces you can use=20 hardboard which is easily cut with an electric jigsaw, and the edges=20 don't need to be straight. Or if the joists are evenly sloping you can=20 cut a long wedge from a bit of timber and just lay it on top (a circular=20 saw would be better for that). I reckon you could buy the tools you need for about =A3100, and the=20 materials for about =A330.

[kellywatson]

The house was bought from plans and the mortgage valuation was based on the plans as it was not built.

I had never heard of professional snaggers before I got all these problems. This is my first property purchase and I was a bit (ok a lot) naive.

The problem we have is exacltly as described the worst area is in the landing next to the adjoining walls. There is sharp downhill slopes over the door ways and we are unsure how to tie in all the rooms and match to the stairway.

Thanks for you help anyway!

kelly

[kellywatson]

Thanks for all your help everyone. Looks like I got a major fight on my hands and a lot to think about.

kelly

[Matt]

Forget the DIY, get a professional in to assess the floors and the cost to rectify, put it in writing to Redrow AND all their directors - get their addresses for a few quid online at

them a set time to respond. Then if no response get someone (NOT YOU) to do the work and then proceed through the small claims court to recover your costs.