Wierd stain on new driveway

[hrhofmann]

Ny thoughts exactly!!!

[Tony]

Mine too. I redid a little walkway with some square patio block and crushed marble stone. I got rid of the stone and made it all block, I had extra blocks from another location. After a rain half of the block was dark and half was light. I redid the walkway again so when it's somewhere between wet and dry, it looks like a checkerboard. When it's all dry you would never notice a difference in the blocks.

[Prof Wonmug]

Here are 3 photos:

1. This view shows the entire stain. It is rust colored. It looks a bit darker than the photo shows. Viewing the photo from just below horizontal gives a good image.

The shape is about the same as the tree shadow. Notice the clean strip under the hedge. This seems to me to confirm that it came from above.

1. This is a slightly closer view. The stain area was never "wet".

1. This is a closeup view. Notice that within the larger stain, there are areas that are less stained. It seems to me that if it rained down from above, it would have stained everywhere about the same.

As far as I know. They arrived on 3-4 pallets and I believe the wrapper had the same lot number.

In any case, they were all the same color when first installed and the stain appeared in one day.

[Prof Wonmug]

Unfortunately, it's been cloudly the last couple of days. I did stand under the tree several times. I could not see or feel anything. I also felt as many leaves as I could reach. They were dry (not sticky) and I could not see any insects or sap.

I also called a local arborist. He said that if it was aphids, the stain would be black, not rust colored, and would be caused my mold (I think). He also said it could not happen in one day.

[Square Peg]

Really? You think the Virgin Mary appearing in a stain on a driveway is any different than some guy in upstate NY digging up some "golden plates", or Native Americans coming from the Holy Land in a submarine (clearly impossible based on DNA evidence), or god allowing a bunch of dirty old men to take dozens of wives and then changing his mind when Utah wanted to become a state, or several million people being protected from satan by magic underwear?

Really?

[Prof Wonmug]

Well, the pavers have been in for several weeks. We've had rain and hot days during that period. Whether they were wet or dry, they all looked more or less the same. No stains. Two days ago, this stain appeared in one day. It's still there. It does not follow the edges of the pavers. It looks exactly like the shadow of the overhanging tree.

I didn't try the heat gun, because it's not close to an outlet. I'm going to try various cleaners today. If that doesn't work, I'll try the heat gun, but I can't see how that would explain the stain.

Check out the photos I uploaded. (Posted to another reply.)

[Prof Wonmug]

My wife says "enough already". I have to get rid of the stain and she doesn't care if I figure out where it came from. ;-)

I'm going to try some bleach and some standard cleaners on some small areas. Does anyone have any suggestions for what type of cleaner might be most effective?

[Bob F]

Noticeing that the stain doesn't occur below the hedge, it is pretty clear that the stain is something dropping from the tree. Aphid dew, other bug waste, or pollen?

[Prof Wonmug]

That's what I think. A local arborist (by phone) ruled out aphids and he said pollen was unlikely.

At this point, I am more interested in how to remove it.

[norminn]

I've only looked at the first picture so far. Looking at the lower portion of the picture, it looks like the strip along the edge nearest the hedge is of a different color, even where the "stain" isn't present.

What was there before the pavers were installed? Contacted the contractor? County extension service"? Any work done in the area of the stain since the pavers were installed? I would not try any correction or cleaning before finding out what caused the stain.

[mike]

Excuse me if this was covered, but unless you plan on removing the tree, won't this (tannin?) stain come right back?

[Prof Wonmug]

That's a concern, of course. Removing the tree is not an option, but if I can figure out what it is, maybe it can be treated or prevented. Or maybe that will suggest how best to remove it.

It's a beautiful tree. If I have to clean the driveway 1-2/year, I'll live with that.

We've lived here for 20 years and this has never happened before, unless it was not visible on the old asphalt driveway.

[Prof Wonmug]

You have a sharp eye! I hadn't noticed that before.

I just went out to take a look at that area. The pavers that are under the hedge overhang do look cleaner or brighter than those just outside the overhand. Then I looked up at the tree. The tree that I suspect, actually is wider than the stain. It extends several feet toward the bottom of the first photo. But there is another smaller tree of a different species under it. I suspect that the smaller tree prevented some of whatever dropped down from reaching the driveway. You can't see it on this photo, but the stain does seem to extend to thge bottom of the photo.

As you can see, the hedge is not straight. When we put the pavers in, we had to make a decision about that edge. We decided to have a straight edge on the pavers knowing that the hedge would overhang a bit in that area. We planned to cut the hedge back to a straight line, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

It was an asphalt driveway that was at least 40 years old. The pavers are very close to the same footprint as the old driveway.

And ask what?

The pavers have been in about a month. The city has been digging up the street for new utility lines. That started at least a month before the new driveway and is still not done. But I cannot see how that could cause a stain like this that has so many indications of falling from above.

I may not have that luxury. My wife has a big party on Saturday. I will be in hot water if the stain is not gone. I even suggested parking a car in that spot.

[norminn]

If the contractor has been in business a while, he may have seen the problem before. My county extension service has entomologists on staff

- they have answered all the bug questions I have taken to them. Your issue it so peculiar, it is maddening :o) Even if it is bug droppings, it is odd that the breeze didn't carry them into a broader distribution. I'd try laying down white cardboard to see what lands :o) I'm a dedicated detective and hate when I can't figure stuff out :o) Does the neighbor on that side have a sprinkler that could hit the area? Would have to be a mighty dose of rusty water to cause a stain in such a short period of time.

Then you'll get oil stains and it will be YOUR fault ;o) Get a ladder out and have your wife climb up there and see what kind of bugs are in the tree...

[Colbyt]

Try some lemon juice from the bottle on a very small area. Let it sit for a minute and rinse well.

While we are at it, how deep is the paver base in this area? Everyone thinks the stain is from above. What if it is coming from a chemical reaction from below? Some trees secrete nasty stuff from the roots though I am at a complete loss as to what it might be in your case. I recall getting orange hands while pulling out the roots of some tree/bush.

Colbyt

[dpb]

...

None of the pictures show the tree itself which means can't identify it for certain nor see anything that might be telling about it.

...

The shape certainly is conclusive it came from the tree; again w/o more details on the source it's not reasonable to expect too much on discerning the actual cause since it's a result not a cause.

See above...

More than likely; unless there is an infestation of something this year which is possible but not terribly likely to have not been at least earlier signs if so--problem generally grow w/ time rather than come in full bloom initially, so to speak.

As for the clean up, pressure wash and what goes away goes away and what doesn't, doesn't. There are surely more significant issues to worry about????

--

[Prof Wonmug]

I'll give that a try.

I can't see it coming from below. The pavers are 3-4 inches thick. Under that is about 2-3 inches of gravel. Under that is 2-3 inches of new dirt leveled and compacted. And, the stain appeared in just a few hours and is in the exact shape of the tree shadow.

Anyway, thanks for the lemon juice suggestion.

[willshak]

Prof Wonmug wrote the following:

Pavers are stored outdoors in all kinds of weather. They probably get saturated and take time to dry out. The pavers that were put down in the sun probably dried enough, but the ones in the shade are still damp. You probably noticed the difference because when the pavers were freshly laid, they were all equally damp. Spray some water on the dry ones around the shaded area and see if they all become the same color as the shaded ones.

[norminn]

Mebbe they are Chinese pavers with iron waste mixed in that started to rust?

[Sanity]

Why don't you just call the contractor up and ask him to take a look. He might know a helluva lot more than the people here. If not too many pavers are involved, he might even be nice enough to replace them for you at a reduced price or for free.