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Musing ........ rant

Yeah! It should be free like satellite TV!

Reply to
salty
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What is so hard about HVAC, electrical and plumbing?

Reply to
Robert Allison

The person who gave you the quote - how long did he say all this work might take?

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

JoeSpareBedroom wrote: ...

More to the point, how long did it take him and what was his hourly wage (exclusive, of course, of taxes including self-employment/FICA/workmans comp, health and other benefits, etc., etc, etc., ...?

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Reply to
dpb

It didn't take "him" any time at all, because the OP didn't have the guy do the work.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

Just going over some proposals from a recently completing project ......

Hang six interior doors Install baseboard in a 1,000 sf addition Install door knobs and locks Install door trim

NO PAINT OR TOUCH UP

$1,524 LABOR ONLY

I did the work myself. First doors I ever hung. A couple of burps, but the doors work fine. Locks I know. Bought a second hand DeWalt compound miter saw for $50. Bought a used Porter Cable nailer, $40.

Total cost, less than $250. Whoops, forgot the paint, which is another $25. And I own the saw and nailer, which are slick. I can use them for lots of other projects.

Why do some people think they're worth so much?

I can understand hvac and electric and plumbing and some of the specialty trades. What's so hard about doors and trim?

Steve

Reply to
SteveB

"HIM" was referring to OP...to provide "him" w/ a proper frame of reference... :(

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Reply to
dpb

License? Advertising? Vehicle? Insurance? Phone? Wages? Heck, the guy probably also wants to make a livng. What did you think a fair price?

Reply to
Norminn

OK, but that's the other side of the coin. If I'm a neurosurgeon and my time's worth (random guess) $1400 per hour, I'd have to be nuts to think I'd be saving money by doing a $1500 home project myself if it means losing a day of work.

I want to know how long the contractor said the work would take.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

Exactly. I got an estimate to paint my car, $3,750.00. I bought a couple of gallons of SW, a brush & roller, total cost: $60.00

Another example is, a landscaper wanted $80 each time to cut my lawn. I have grandma doing it for free. Reminds me, I'm going to have to go out and see how she's coming along. Haven't seen her for a couple of days.

If you're satisfied with an unprofessional job, why pay a professional?

Reply to
Kirk R.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote: ...

Fine, but I was answering the original question -- "why do people think they're worth so much?" -- if the OP will calculate his time even reduced by some factor for the contractor's experience, he'll discover that time isn't worth nearly as much as he thought it was...

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Reply to
dpb

There is a large portion of society (the majority?) that can't fix anything on their own. I feel so sorry for them.

Imagine what it would be like to walk out to your car on a cold morning, put your key in the ignition, turn it, see that nothing happened, and have absolutely no clue what might be wrong. What a sense of helplessness that must be - when the only option is to call for a tow and pay a repair bill. Total dependence on others.

There is a flip side, though.

I miss brushing my teeth in peace. Now as I perform the morning ritual, instead of thinking of nothing more than the tasty toothpaste, my mind is filled with images of well pumps, pitless adapters, casings, polyethylene pipes, header tanks, pressure switches, copper, valves, fittings, filters, drains, traps, tanks, baffles, terracotta pipes, and gravel. I can't drive a car without a constant sense of the thousands of parts - each one totally essential to the operation of the vehicle - that can so easily fail at any moment.

I have to wonder how a medical doctor feels, knowing that the human body is basically on the edge of death at any moment. The smallest microvolts keeping the heart beating. Solitary nucleotides in endless clumps of DNA, under constant attack by ambient radiation, each with a sole responsibility of keeping cancer at bay. A never ending battle of bacteria, fungi, and immune system all in a delicate balance. But, it must satisfying to know how to fix it all.

Reply to
The Reverend Natural Light

I've been dissatisfied with the quality and workmanship of everything I've ever paid a "professional" to do. DIY quality should be *at least* as good as professional.

Professionals just don't have the time to do a really nice job. A pro tiler has to start and finish a bathroom remodel in two days. I have two months of spare time if that's what it takes to make the results perfect.

Reply to
The Reverend Natural Light

Simple: because those are the prices people are willing to pay.

A contractor can't stay in business if nobody will hire them. So the fact that so many contractors exist, and have existed for many years, makes it pretty obvious that people are willing to pay for them. The people who tell contractors what they're "worth" are their customers.

And they pay those prices because a lot of people just don't want to be bothered. What's wrong with that? I'd probably hang those doors and install those locks myself too, but there are other things I probably wouldn't do. (Installing windows, for instance, or a new roof.) Who's to tell me what things I "should" do myself? There are things we're all comfortable with and other things we're not and those things are different for everybody. And if I feel like hanging doors and installing trim and locksets is worth $1,500, then maybe I'll pay that. If I don't, I won't.

So you're good at hanging doors and don't need a contractor. Good for you. But nothing wrong with someone else who feels differently about it.

Reply to
basscadet75

Most DIYers are satisfied with their projects. But, they wouldn't know where they messed up, unless their mistakes are pointed out by a professional.

It's unfortunate, you do not know the meaning of a professional. A professional always does the job correct, regardless the field or nature of work.

If you don't know how to hire a professional, at least consult with someone, which knows the industry and can hire a professional for you. As you pointed out, you didn't know how to hire a professional, and the work preformed can be very disappointing. Unfortunately, a large part of the blame is on you. Thanks for sharing some of life's lessons.

Reply to
Kirk R.

Type? (pocket/game room glass pane French type)

8 foot solid core heavy bastards?

MDF/Oak/Maple?

Comes with the door install. At least by me!

Requires few fasteners.

I was lucky on my first door (exterior metal). The more I learn about doors the less I know. Every one is different :)) Carry many levels...

Oren

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Reply to
Oren

Nothing at all, which is why I do all that myself. The savings in labor costs offsets the fact that I use higher grade parts.

Reply to
Pete C.

What a bunch of crap. You must be a "professional". If everyone believed this crap you could charge double.

Reply to
Moo

I've seen many jobs of various types done by professionals that were not up to my DIY standards, which is another reasons I DIY pretty much everything.

When I DIY I know the job will be done not only 100% correctly, but also to my standards which exceed code minimums that a professional would typically work to. I use higher quality materials as well, such as Square D QO panels, vs. the low end brands many professionals would install.

My work is done to a higher level of detail and neatness than that of many professionals I've seen. My DIY work also is completed in nearly the same time frame as that of most professionals, perhaps 25% longer at most for jobs I'm in no hurry on.

Certainly DIY isn't appropriate for everyone, but neither is professional always better than DIY.

Reply to
Pete C.

"Moo" wrote

I am a professional in my field, which is not construction. So, I totally understand Kirk's point.

In most fields, newbies, apprentices, and such have a _lot_ to learn before becoming a professional. All of us must start at the beginning, and it takes years to become a professional.

I wouldn't dream of going back and starting at an inexperienced wage and having to start at the beginning. Although, even being a professional, learning new & better techiniques is an every day occurrence.

Practice doesn't make perfect, but perfect practice does. Exactly, what don't you understand about being a professional?

Reply to
U.L. Tested

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