Thinking of getting rid of my FPE stab lock panel.
the original 60 amp fuse panel was really small, the 100 amp FPE larger the 200 amp huge.
the old original circuits wires in the breaker box are short. to avoid more work boxes is it OK to join wires in the panel so they are long enough to reach the breakers?
some sort of splixces or wire nuts?
You have to be kidding.
no i have seen splices in replacement main panels, but always wondered if they were legal
Yes, it's fine... or I'm in a whole lot of trouble
Yes you can make connections in a panel; think of it as a huge junction box. You don't want a lot of splices in the panel for new work because it implies that you didn't know what you were doing. But for retrofit work, you gotta do what ya gotta do.
The FPE panels were kind of small for the number of breakers they held, so you could get in trouble with too many condutors for the cubic inches if you weren't careful. But it sounds like you are going to gut the FPE box and put a new modern panel next to it and splice into the wires inside the old FPE panel? I did something like that with my old fusebox when I upgraded to a 150A service.
Bob
my current main is mounted directly on the block wall. i plan on trashing it completely and mouting it to plywood, all new panel, all new everything.
but those old lines are too short to begin with plus tthe panel will need moved some to clear the garage door tracks. its a tight fit the home is 50 years old.
anytime i added a circuit i left the romex a little long for the day the main gets replaced.
Depending on how short and how many, my initial reaction is to use the existing panel (remounted if need be) as a junction box to make the extension connections and then run from there to the new panel rather than make the junctions in the new box.
But, if there weren't very original circuits, I might change my mind. Seems like in our previous discussion you said the existing box might not be in great physical shape too, however, so I might even opt for a new empty box simply to use as the splicing box.
I'm not absolutely sure on what the Code says about it, but somehow it just seems better to me have the junctions elsewhere although there really is no fundamental difference that I can see.
the box is rusty, and if i remount to plywood the box will not clear the garage door tracks, as it is the cover barely slides on the box.
I REALLY want everything new and spiffy, the area this will go in is kinda small bordered by the front of the house, a sump pump drain line and other obstructions. the only good thing is that every time i added a circuit i left some extra romex.
the current panel is way overfull, packed with all half breakers, unused 240 volt lines for electric stove and dryer neither of which we have.
i have a single empty half breaker slot and havent installed it cause theres just no room.
When I replaced my service I had a bunch of old circuits that were short. I didn't want to clutter up my new box so I bought a big grey PVC Carlon J box and some terminal strips with set screw barrel lugs in them for my splices. I then nippled into the new panel with clean runs of THHN. If you keep the nipple short (
That's fine as long as all his short cables are non metallic
My too short cables are all BX original to the home
Sounds like from last string in the thread that to get a "really clean and spiffy" final installation you may need to make some other modifications to get necessary clearance(s). I had assumed one would run conduit from a junction box to the panel. I'm having difficulty imagining an area w/ a garage door track so close to the side wall there's insufficient room for a panel box, but then again, there are a lot of unusual situations out there... :)
Is there a code limit on minimum height above floor for the panel? Other than convenience and some access control for kiddies, seems like putting the junction box roughly where the existing box is so old circuits reach and the new panel either above or below would be the alternative (obviously w/o seeing the actual location this is all hypothesis).
I suppose in the worst possible scenario one could even have multiple smaller junction boxes to allow for a rearrangement depending on the direction from which the original circuits were fed.
Alternatively, if one were really into doing it up "right", one could conceivably pull a new cable from the first junction point in each old circuit that was too short to reach the new panel. After all, it's _only_ tearing up and repairing... :)
Actually, re-reading the above, it seems to me if the existing circuits now reach the panel (and they must) then the terminal block terminations would, in fact, have the effect of lengthening them slightly as there would a more direct route inside the box to the terminal block in general than to the existing breakers. So, I'm left w/ the thought that the only real issue is to rearrange whatever else or inset the panel or find one shallow enough to fit the area.
(Sounds like just the spot for a retrofit kit...)
That throws a monkey in the wrench. Splice in the panel and get on with your life. The only thing close to being a prohibition against it is 312.8 and that says it is OK where space is provided. Since a splice does not add to wire count there must be space.
posted for all of us... I don't top post - see either inline or at bottom.
Do you have a reference for these? Not a trick question and I DO appreciate the time you give to provide information. You have been around a long time...
No problem Try
Yes, you can splice inside a panel, but it's generally poor form.
I just replaced the crappy old Stab-Loc incendiary device in my current house with a shiny new QO panel as seen here:
I've worked on about eight other service upgrades done similarly elsewhere that were inspected however and all passed inspection with rave reviews.
Pete C.
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