a problem with electric meters?

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Sjouke Burry wrote the following on 5/18/2012 8:19 PM (ET):

How would he/she know you are home or away? Does the meter stop running when you leave the house? I would think it would be easier for them to check the present occupancy of the home when they are standing at the meter.
--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
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but
because
occupancy

When you are out, consumption of power kind of drops off. when you are sleeping, the same. When you are on vacation, it drops off for several days. With some nice plotting software it will make the change in load pattern obvious, the units proposed in the Netherlands have a 15 minute sample rate. Talk about big brother watching you.
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At night I leave a light on when I go out. If I'm home, I play the radio, maybe 10 watts. Sometimes the TV -- isn't that 50 watts for a 12" color tv.

If I'm sleeping at home, I'm home.

That assumes anyone would want to do that for me. A burglar would be better off going to a fancier n'hood. And I'll have my own burglar alarm up and running again soon. That only uses about 10 watts iirc, so he won't know until he sets it off.
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My power use varies more from day to day when I'm home than it does between home and away.
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wrote:

Burglars usually just ring the doorbell to see if anyone's home. Perhaps a bit low tech, but still, it works just fine...
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to answer the original question,"smart meters" are electric meters for homes that monitor your power usage continuously and keep record of how much power is used at what times of the day and night,periodically read remotely by the power company.
So they have a detailed record of YOUR lifestyle,when you do things that use power. you may not like that data being accumulated and available to gov't officials.(and maybe private companies too. It's data that is worth something,thus salable.) they may also have the capability to remotely CONTROL(shut off) some of your home's appliances to aid the power company in load managment.
You may not like the power company turning off your AC,water heater,or washer-dryer at peak demand times.
I'm not sure if these will also turn off electric car chargers.
and you won't KNOW when these items are off....there will not be any announcement when it occurs.
--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
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wrote:

A smart METER cannot load shed - it cannot selectively control loads. A "smart center" can. We don't have them yet in Ontario, and I can't see them coming for quite some time as they will rquire TOTAL RETROFIT of EVERY service panel to make them work. The electrical utility won't pay for it - and no provinvial government that mandates the homeowner pays for it will EVER be re-elected.
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On Mon, 21 May 2012 20:15:02 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

You are right, the meter has nothing to do with load sheading. I had that in my condo for a while and it involves a sealed control box that intercepts your feeds to the selected equipment. They installed for free but when they stopped the program they abandoned the equipment in place and I would have had to pay to have it removed. The HVAC guys ripped it out when I replaced the A/C unit.
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On 5/21/2012 11:45 PM, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Our local utility has offered that as an option for decades. If you join the program, they install the switch on your a/c unit. It cycles the a/c off and on at 15-20 minute intervals. In return, you get a 15% discount on your electric bill from June through September. During peak demand (10-15 days a year), they remotely activate the switches
As for all the fearmongering about smart meters and their mythical health effects, it's hard to take that seriously when the very people screeching about it don't. The majority of them think nothing about using their cellphones and other radio frequency-employing convenience devices. As for the supposed privacy issues, public and private organizations already have access to so much household and personal data, it wouldn't make much difference. Your local utility can provide you with a spreadsheet showing energy consumption by household so you can compare your usage to your neighbors. Smart meters would only fine-tune the data by plotting usage against time.
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On Mon, 21 May 2012 20:15:02 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

The ones being installed by FPL, 4.3 Million residential meters, can remotely switch the 240v service to 120v, by connecting both legs to the same 120v input. Thus disabling nearly all 220v appliances in the household.
They can also remotely turn on and off the service.
It's just a matter of time before the wireless protocal get's hacked and someone else takes control.
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On 5/30/2012 6:43 AM, T. Keating wrote: ...

I don't see any indication of that in the GE product data sheet. Can you provide a link to that; it seems unlikely design feature to me.

...
If FPL is using a capable-meter and installing the 2-way communications module, then that is a possibility.
Can you confirm which GE model FPL is actually using and which options they bought?
--
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I haven't see any online document listing the ordering options with their letter designations. For that info you must call them up, and track down the right person.

Ordering options on FPL's GE-210+ residential meters are:
O = AMR, V2 = Simple Voltage event monitor, F2 = Demand limit, J2 = Emergency Load reduction(same leg of 110V connected to both sides, no"0v appliance operation.) U2 = Remote disconnect & Prepaid disconnect.
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Particularly since it would put the entire load on one side of the transformer and lead in (and neutral connection).

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On Wed, 30 May 2012 20:30:45 -0400, " snipped-for-privacy@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"
wrote:

http://www.gedigitalenergy.com/products/brochures/I210_Family.pdf
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On 5/31/2012 3:02 AM, T. Keating wrote:

...
...
I've read that brochure from cover to cover several times and still see no indication of the above "capability". Remote deactivation, yes; 240V disable--don't see it.
--
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If it did connect both hots going into the house to one hot in the service cable, that would disable the 240V loads in the house. But unless the service conductors from the street to the house were capable of handling the double load, it would exceed their current carrying capability.
Example:
200A service, so the three conductors are rated to carry 200A and no conductor ever exceeds that. You could have 200A coming on one hot, returning on the neutral. Or you could have 200A coming on one hot, returning on the other. Or any combo of the above, but it would never exceed 200A in any conductor.
Now connect both hots in the house to one incoming hot and you could pull 400A through that one conductor and have it return via the neutral.
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On Thu, 31 May 2012 07:49:00 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net"

You COULD, but the big loads are "generally" 240.
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On 5/31/2012 11:59 AM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:
...

...
Precisely the reason I really think it's not likely the meter actually does this...

But Code doesn't all "generally" in addressing overloading a circuit protection/wire sizing...
It would be in violation if it were done after the meter; I don't see how it wouldn't also be so if the meter did it.
--
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On May 31, 12:59pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

You could what? Exceed the the service cable rating by putting 400 amps through a conductor rated for 200? This would not even pass code, ie an implementation where the meter has the capability to overload the conductors. If it was to be implemented it would require changing the service conductors to ones rated 400 amps. How much you think that would cost?
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On Thu, 31 May 2012 10:55:48 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net"

You did not understand what I said. I sait it QWAS POSSIBLE it would overload the conductors, but UNLIKELY as MOST heavy loads are 220 volt loads. The drier, the oven, the stovetop, the Air Conditioning, all permanently installed electric heat, the water heater - are pretty well ALL 240 volt loads - so the chance that the feed cables would - or even COULD be overloaded is rather remote at best.
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