Heat Pump Fan Motor Install Question

[Steve]

One leg remains energized with miliamp current so that winding acts as a crank case heater in the compressors. this is especially important in heat pumps.

[Stormin Mormon]

If you follow the wires back to the circuit breaker panel, the black and yellow should go to a two pole circuit breaker, providing hot and hot.

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

.

Thank you for helping me to accept that. Alot of evidence was building up on that side, and I've been fighting it tooth and nail. The wiring diagram, and the rest of the pieces, makes more sense in that light!

Dern lady at the electrical supply emphasized I should attach the yellow wire to Common!!!

Thank you again!

Bill

[Bill]

Excuse me for top-posting (I'm try to save you time).

Dear Mr. Dufas and others who have provided assistance to me,

I just wanted to let you know that my fan motor install appears to have worked out successfully. I made sure I had a clear path to the quick-disconnect and gave my wife the first honors today, but she was too afraid. I set the thermostat to go on, and the fan went on (and in the right direction (CWLE)), cool air came out where it was supposed to, and everything was hunky-dory! : )

By biggest surprise during the install was that I needed to splice wires due to shorter ones attached to the new motor. This added two days to my installation. One to learn how to splice wires properly, and one for me to get what I needed, and to practice a little and to do the work. I am confident that the experience, tools and techniques I learned on this project will be valuable to me on my road to being a DIY'er. I bought crimp-pliers too (i.e. I didn't "cheap-out"), besides a heat gun.

Besides for having a greater understanding of my heat-pump unit (I'm a relatively new home-owner), It is very nice to have learned how to splice wires. This project was a very good challenge for me, and I appreciate my new knowledge. Thank you very much!

Bill

The Dar>> The Dar>>>>

[john]

Since your top posting to save time, Keep in mind that a heat pump is not a cheap piece of equipment and if working on one goes sour, you'll need a tech to repair it and the price will reflect whatever is wrong plus whatever you might have accidently done. Be careful out there. You might consider taking the make and model number and check on what a new unit would cost you if the worst case scenario ever rears it's ugly head.

[Bill]

Actually the person/company that did the diagnosis was recommending a replacement of the heat pump and furnace. So, if i adopted his perspective (which I didn't and don't), I had very little to lose!

I've built and made repairs to 3 computers. I didn't do anything accidently. Electronically, we are basically talking about 4 wires.

Ironically, I think the "tech" who replaced the fan motor capacitor last summer screwed up by looking at the micro-Farad rating on the side of the heat-pump rather than the actual motor in the unit. Factory was

7.5 and and that's what he put in. New one was 5. I'll double check and get reply back.

Bill

[Bill]

I will retract my last comment. I checked and the motor I took out was most likely the factory one, based on my Google search of the model number. The person who did the work was actually the brother of the real tech, and they conversed over the phone. Weather was "very hot" that week and business must have been great! I don't think I got a discount for that ($265 to diagnose and replace a capacitor--and it was "burst").

As an aspiring DIY'er, I really love doing things like this. I now have MUCH greater knowledge about how my heat-pump system works and I learned ALOT! Thank you again to eveyone who provided help and/or concern!

Bill

[Steve]

Its not a matter of "if", its a matter of *WHEN*. Assuming a top quality (not cheap) 3 ton heat pump system, you can figure a 15SEER replacement system installed by a competent, licensed, bonded, insured, professionally trained Master Tech(also not cheap), to be in the neighborhood of $7,000

*INSTALLED*.

[Bill]

How much of that is the wholesale price of the hardware?

[Stormin Mormon]

I'm fairly sure Steve won't provide answer to that.

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

.

How much of that is the wholesale price of the hardware?

[The Daring Dufas]

People who pay a lawyer $250.00 for a few sheets of paper have a meltdown when I charge them $250.00 for an electric motor. I sell the same thing a lawyer sells, "my time" and nothing irritates me more than someone thinking my time isn't worth anything even though I've spent four decades acquiring the knowledge and skills necessary to do the things they can't do themselves. When someone gets a bill from me and asks "What did the parts cost you?" my answer is "The material and ability cost me upwards of $1,000,000.00, would you like to pay the entire cost of what was necessary for me to do the job?". The really dense folks don't grok what I tell them. ^_^

TDD

[Bill]

I *certainly* am not suggesting your time is not very valuable. But I think it's reasonable to disclose to a potential customer what you are charging for it.

For something in the neighborhood of $150, Sears will come to your home and fix "whatever is wrong with your dishwasher, parts extra". This does not disclose that they will charge multiple times, for the parts, what you might regard as the regular retail price. I consider that misleading, for instance. Just my opinion. IMO, Mr. D. Dufas is tops!

Bill

When someone gets a bill

[Steve]

How much is the wholesale price of the ingredients for that pizza that you just bought? How much is the wholesale price for the materials to make that new car? How much is the wholesale cost of that piece of paper you got from a lawyer? How much is the wholesale cost of the materials to build that house you live in? There is a lot more to it than *just* the wholesale costs of parts/materials/equipment.

Its not about my costs of equipment, materials, training, tools, continuing education, overhead, licensing, service truck and all of its costs and expenses(its more than just gas), salaries, taxes or any of the other associated costs and expenses of running a business.... its all about providing top quality service and comfort solutions to my customers and not go broke because I didn't charge enough.

[Bill]

I could estimate most if not all of the above.

I want you to stay in business, provide jobs, make money and pay taxes. As your customer, I just would like you to be open and honest with me. My perspective, as a customer, is that "to fail to reveal (upon request) is to conceal"--especially since only one of us is writing checks to the other. I expect that after I pay you $100 to come look at my system, that I have already demonstrated sufficient goodwill that you would be forthright.

No matter what we write here, the economics will prevail. Like in this case, I ended up learning what I needed to in order to do the job myself. Of course, I rather enjoy it, even if I don't admit it. I have been working at learning stuff for a long time. A year ago I learned to replace my (broken) garage door spring and replace a garbage disposal, for instance. When I was 17, I rebuilt my carburetor and made many other repairs to my car, and mounted (stuffed) a fish, etc, etc.

From what you wrote, it seems like some of the HVAC companies perhaps are becoming top-heavy with administrative costs. About half appear to be running out of their homes in my neck of the woods.

Cheers, Bill

[Steve]

I do run my company out of my home.... if I had a storefront, my overhead would increase by well over $5,000 per month. The "administrative costs" are a necessary evil for any legitmate business. Having been in business for 17 years, I figure I have a pretty good handle on the business of running a business. My companys business model is based on a very modest 10% after tax

*NET* profit. No I don't break down pricing, my company does everything, including system replacements with flat rate pricing (we don't charge "labor"). There are no surprises for the customer... they know what it will cost before I make any repairs to their system. The only thing I cannot tell them in advance, is how much refrigerant it will need, or how much needs to be recovered.until after I balance the refrigerant charge, and weigh the can.

The question you need to ask yourself is this... do you want to deal with a fly-by-night, or somebody who "does it on the side"? or do you want a certified master, that is licensed(EPA card is *NOT* a license), bonded, insured, and profesionally trained to service and repair your system?? You can get it done cheap, or you can get it done right the first time.

[Steve]

Did I mention that HVAC contracting is a *RETAIL* business?? Try going into any other retail business and ask what their wholesale costs are...... see how that works for you.

[Bill]

You say that like you have something to hide. I am mainly suggesting that I will choose to retain contractors that I trust. THAT means more to me than different sorts of certification (which I am not in a very good position to assess). As I mentioned earlier, two episodes ago a "certified" contractor sent his brother..and they conversed over the phone. So far I have dealt with 3 HVAC tech companies, and I keep notes on the service I receive from each one. That the last company, 30 experienced as they are, encouraged me turn this problem into a "full system replacement" may make me hesitate to call them back soon--unless perhaps, that's what I am seeking. With all of the certification that they surely possess, they have convinced me on their first visit that I can't trust them. That's one customer's perpective anyway.

With 17 years in the business, you evidently have a lot of satified customers! I know from experience that having satisfied customers brings satisfaction in itself. Take care.

Bill

[Bill]

Caveat emptor, huh? I guess that helps illustrate why having a little knowledge is valuable.

Just curious, do you find that the percentage of customers say "No, I don't want you to do the work (or want the work done)" depends on the weather? HVAC seems like an interesting business.

I have given some thought to trying to become certified as some sort of "Handyman" (not HVAC). I know a little about alot and alot about a little. : )

Bill

Try going into

[Steve]

I don't have anything to hide... however, as a customer you don't have a need to know what my costs and expenses are unless you are my local IRS agent doing another audit. What you need to know is that I have the training, education, and experience to do the job right the first time and guarentee my repairs, as well as your satisfaction. I'm not cheap, and don't pretend to be because I provide a premium service. There are lots of folks who will work for nothing and will go bankrupt within 6 months of opening their doors. They won't be there when you need them again, I will.

first problem, you didn't have a certified master show up, you had his flunky brother... a wannabe apprentice. Big problem with medium and large companies, they may only have ONE masters license holder, and the rest of the folks they have working for them are questionable at best.

So that one sent you a "salesnition"... still not a certified master or even journeyman level.

You still haven't found a good technician... your search is not over. Try calling your local wholesale supply house and asking them whos the best tech/company to call, and not the one who sells the most boxes. Who would they trust to do work in their familys home.

[Steve]

Having a little knowledge is dangerous.

Maybe 1 or 2 customers a year, but only because they just don't have the money to pay for the needed repairs. Even at that, I give them options for the minimum required repairs to get the system to function, and defer needed maintenance to a later date.

Good luck with that....

[Bill]

Well that demonstrates that it's not exactly like modern "retail" even if it being practiced as such. I enjoyed reading your earlier remarks and and am willing to leave it at that if you are.

Regards, Bill