Green potatoes

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On 11/06/2014 3:30 AM, Todd wrote:

Where is your cite to prove that there was no T2 diabetes amongst hunter gatherers?

As is obesity and falling rates of physical activity according to the WHO.
We need to use the same smarts that got us

As will increased physical activity, eating in moderation and loss of weight.

Then perhaps you could try to learn self control.
I am really enjoying being

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On 06/10/2014 10:31 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

Hi Fran,
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Diabetes%20among%20hunter%20gatherers
There is a nice article on the Hadza over at: http://originalpeople.org/hadza-people-diabetes/
Many in public health believe that a major culprit is our sedentary lifestyle. Faced with relatively few physical demands today, our bodies burn fewer calories than they evolved to consume — and those unspent calories pile up over time as fat. The World Health Organization, in discussing the root causes of obesity, has cited a “decrease in physical activity due to the increasingly sedentary nature of many forms of work, changing modes of transportation and increasing urbanization.”
This is a nice theory. But is it true? To find out, my colleagues and I recently measured daily energy expenditure among the Hadza people of Tanzania, one of the few remaining populations of traditional hunter-gatherers. Would the Hadza, whose basic way of life is so similar to that of our distant ancestors, expend more energy than we do?
Our findings, published last month in the journal PLoS ONE, indicate that they don’t, suggesting that inactivity is not the source of modern obesity.
Studies on the Inuits and the Aleuts too. Returning to their ancestral diets gets rid of the diabetes.
Unfortunately for Diabetics, they are suffering from a lot of fat bigotry. T2 Diabetes is a simple injury caused by consuming unnatural amounts of carbohydrates. You can heal from it, but you have to stop the insult that caused it in the first place.
Here is the thing about fat bigots. They see the human body as, what we call in engineering terms, an "open loop" system. It is not. It is one of the most complex and wonder "closed loop" system ever created. And being "closed loop", your body compensates. This is why you can stand on two feet. This is also why skinny people don't get fat when they over eat.
The Fat Bigots want Diabetes and obesity to a "character flaw" in those they "condescend" on. It is a failure of the control system involved in the closed loop to compensate. The only "character flaw" is the bigotry.
-T
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On 12/06/2014 8:11 AM, Todd wrote:

You didn't actually read the cites there did you? Or if you did, you clearly didn't understand the more scholarly ones that show that there is a genetic preponderance amongst hunter gatherers to develop type 2 diabetes and why that is so.
Hint: That preponderance has NOTHING to do with carbohydrates or the consumption of them.

There is absolutely no evidence to support that claim. There ARE lots and lots sites and cites that say that but not one I've yet read could be considered to be reputable or withstand even basic scrutiny.

Do you actually read what you write to see if it makes any sense?

You do write a lot of drivel that has nothing to do with what is being discussed. You might make more sense if you bothered to try to understand what is being said to you, what you are being asked and why you are being asked something but more especially you might have a better understanding if you bothered to actually READ your own cites.
YOU gave cites that show that hunter gatherers have a known preponderance for developing T2 diabetes.
Their tendency to develop T2 diabetes once they follow a first world diet has nothing to do with just eating carbohydrates ACCORDING TO YOUR OWN CITES.
And if you really do insist on being all Paleo because you still choose to believe it, then you will also stop stuffing your face to excess and you will get out and do some exercise.
The reasons why you should stop the excess stuffing of your face and get out and do some exercise are listed in those very Paleo cites YOU gave. Read them.
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On 06/11/2014 11:08 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

Fran,
You only looked at the sections of the Paleo that you agree with. You totally missed the part about the carbs. And, yes, I do exercise more.
I don't think anything I could write you would rise to the level that you require to get past your preconceive notions.
Basically, here it is in a nutshell. I got T2 Diabetes. I figured out how to deal with it. I am healing. I am telling others how as well because it is the decent thing to do.
As my GP allopath told me when he first saw me, your ate too may carbohydrates and you burned your self out. That is an injury.
I have lived through this. I know what I am talking about. And, I am healing.
If I am so full of it, why would I be drug free and healing?
If you ever burn yourself out as well, see if you can find me. I will tell you how I healed myself. You can take it or leave it.
-T
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On 06/10/2014 10:31 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

"Obesity" is from the excess consumption of carbs. To get fat required high blood sugar and insulin (the fat hormone).
You can't get fat off of fat (keytones). Fat is use or lose.
I had to learn all this stuff after getting diagnosed.
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On 12/06/2014 8:13 AM, Todd wrote:

Obesity has a variety of causes and is not due to just high blood sugar. The correlation between obesity and T2 diabetes is well documented in the US by the CDC and in the rest of the world by the WHO.
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On 06/11/2014 10:13 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

The fat bigots and the special interests would have you believe that.
By the way, the initial stages of T2, the insulin resistance causes you to put on weight. They didn't mention that, did they. It is all part of their cover up. "Oh you have T2 because you are fat!" It is the other way around.
By the way, thank you for the Australian doctor who went up against the special interests and got ulcers treated as an infection.
You should have heard the name calling from the medical community! They made a lot of money off of treating but not healing ulcers. But the guy persevered and we now can finally treat ulcers. (Herbalists always could, but they are just "wack jobs" you know.)
Same thing is going on here with T2. We need an Australian doctor to come here and set the special interests right again.
-T
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On 12/06/2014 3:51 PM, Todd wrote:

Do you read what you write to see if it passes the logic or sanity test?
"Fat bigots" say that high blood sugar is the cause of obesity? These mysterious "special interest" unknowns are involved in some conspiracy saying that the only cause of obesity is high blood sugar.

All those people conspiring.

And another conspiracy theory.

You'd probably not like most Aussie Doctors. They'd tell you to get real and stop seeing conspiracies everywhere.
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On 06/11/2014 11:24 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

Hi Fran,
I looked up the Aussie doctor: Dr. Barry J. Marshal.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Marshall
Thank goodness he persisted and took on the special interests. Oh they called him every name in the book. The special interests went BERSERK! They stood to lose ton of money (and did -- ha ha).
By the way, reducing acid in your stomach causes the bacteria that causes ulcers to thrive. Hmmmm. Let me adjust my aluminum foil hat. Conspiracies everywhere!
If you do not think this crap goes on all the time in the medical community, then you are in for a rude surprise. They are about "treating", not "healing". I found this out the hard way with Diabetes.
If you think I am wrong, look up the side effects of statins. My favorite is "statin-induced rhabdomyolysis", which first cripples you (ruins your muscles), then maims you (kidney failure), eventually it kills you.
Now, try to find a single autopsy study that links serum cholesterol with arteriosclerosis. Give up? I can show you lots of the opposite.
Luckily, both my ER and GP allopaths do not follow the cholesterol fraud. Which is good because I can trust what they say. (I still double check them.) And, neither one is an Aussie. (Occasionally, American doctors can think for themselves too.)
By the way, the doctor that found the real cause of arteriosclerosis (homocystein/inflammation) was Dr. Kilmer McCully. The medical community persecuted him so bad he had to go to court just to hold a position as a coroner! You see, Allopths don't make any money off the sale of B vitamins, folate in particular.
Is my aluminum foil hat (far more stylish than tin foil hats) on too tight?
By the way, even paranoid have enemies.
-T
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On 06/10/2014 10:31 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:

I eat when I am hungry. Eat more at some meals, less at other, occasionally fast when I can't eat (on a customer's site, etc.). Somewhat similar to hunter-gathers.
When my wife or I cook something nice, I do tend to eat a bit more. Bear in mind that I can now taste my food much better.
It all works out. It is a closed loop system.
In the third world, were Diabetes is becoming a huge problem, they eat a hell of a lot less that I do and move a hell of a lot more. The problem is that they eat the same thing that injured me: healthy carbs.
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On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 5:31:32 AM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:



s







We have that 10,000 steps thingie up here too.
I put in the same or more as you in house, garden, shoppin, etc. but it nev er occurred to me that these steps would count toward the 10K. I thought it had to be stride ahead..
Agree 1000% on need to walk more.
It IS true that the greater LA area IS dreadfully spread out, such that it would take a good part of the day to take bus(es) to distant part of county . With better public transport, the suffering could have been mitigated de cades ago. But the government is owned by the oil & gas & automobile baron s who have spent gazillions over time at the est Little Whorehouse in Washi ngton (AKA U.S. Congress) to make sure their products continue to be consum ed, faut de mieux.
Now the traffic is so bad -- supposed to be worst in country ??? that peopl e just give up driving during rush hour which used to begin about 4:30-5:00 . Then 3:30-4:00 - then ... so now it is perpetual rush hour. I've read t hat people spent a WEEK of their lives stuck in traffic!!!
Personally, as a card-carrying science freak, I used to enjoy events at JPL and Caltech. Not any more..check out the 405 Freeway at rush hour! Apocal yptic.
Back to walking: So, it's a great concept, but realistically...
At least we have a lovely promenade overlooking the Pacific -- well used by people and dogs (on leash).
HB
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On 06/10/2014 11:54 AM, Higgs Boson wrote:

Hi Higgs,
I personally hate exercise. Rode a stationary bike once and though I'd died and gone to hell.
But, if you put a fishing rod in my hands and tell me there are trout over that mountain, I will hike, run, crawl over rocks ...
So as Mark Sisson (Mr. Paleo) puts it, the best exercise is the "one that you will do".
I find that walking/hiking will bring back down the blood sugar spikes from stress and down about 10 to 15 points in general.
And, I also find that you don't have to exercise your ass off either, just do something.
TROUT FEAR ME!
-T
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On 11/06/2014 4:54 AM, Higgs Boson wrote:

I found that interesting that it was also in the US so did a google - apparently the 10kstep thing started in Japan in the 60s. It's got around since them :-))

No, apparently the reason why it was started was because the average person only did between 3 and 5k per day and that's not enough. The recommendation is for 30 minutes continuous a day where you can still talk whilst walking plus try to get some vigorous (can't talk) each week.

I have no trouble fitting in walking. I lve on a farm but I also live near a small village and have joined a wlakign gorup there. But another example is that yesterday I had a Specialist Doctor's appointment in the Moderate Smoke. I parked in a multi storey car park at least 15 minutes walk away from the Doctor's rooms and them walked vigorously to the appointment. I was still at least 15 minutes early. I do the same thing when I shop. Put the car in the far distant corner of the supermarket and then wheel my trolley back there and if I need to go to anonther shop I'll walk there from that car park and then walk back with my goodies in a carry back I always carry with me (assuming of course that it's only a few items and not something that I'd need a team of Sherpas to carry back).

Don't you have any sidewalks in your suburb?
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On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 10:45:24 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:

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never occurred to me that these steps would count toward the 10K. I though t it had to be stride ahead..

it would take a good part of the day to take bus(es) to distant part of co unty. With better public transport, the suffering could have been mitigate d decades ago. But the government is owned by the oil & gas & automobile b arons who have spent gazillions over time at the est Little Whorehouse in W ashington (AKA U.S. Congress) to make sure their products continue to be co nsumed, faut de mieux.

eople just give up driving during rush hour which used to begin about 4:30- 5:00. Then 3:30-4:00 - then ... so now it is perpetual rush hour. I've re ad that people spent a WEEK of their lives stuck in traffic!!!

JPL and Caltech. Not any more..check out the 405 Freeway at rush hour! Ap ocalyptic.







d by people and dogs (on leash).

Not in suburb. Very small city on the Pacific(Santa Monica) right next to v ery big city, Los Angeles. Yeah, we have sidewalks, traffic lights; the wh ole enchilada. But plenty of places to walk, esp. the sea cliff Promenade.
(In some huge LA shopping malls, people -- women? older -- have regular wal king groups. Partly social, I would assume? But in this nice climate, why walk indoors?)
In my tiny city we have overbuilding, courtesy of idiot contingent on City Council, resulting in even more traffic, also from people coming in from ou tside to work in high tech, medical, other (it's a desirable area). I'll o ften walk downtown or if backpack overloaded,take the bus,just not to deal with parking.
You asked about sidewalks. One street in ritziest part of town, has no sid ewalks! I kid you not! Those fortunate souls need never be crude pedestri ans. I vaguely understand that in the next county the car-oriented, sterile fortress suburbs often have only driveways; no sidewalks
You are correct in that one can fit in a 10-15 min. fast walk as you descri bed; just takes determination. I go forth inspired!
HB
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On 12/06/2014 3:39 AM, Higgs Boson wrote:

LOL. Glad to hear that you are inspired :-)) I went for a walk this am with a group of women and a bunch of dogs. I took my dog but left him in the car as he gets anxious if expected to walk in unknown territory. We mostly walked in the middle of the road even though there were footpaths - it's great where I live as a couple of cars during the day is a traffic jam. After my walk, I left my car where it was and went to check out a house that may be coming on the market (we're thinking that we need to downsize soonish) and then I walked on to the library. I was glad that I had my backpack as I'd gone to pick up only 1 book I had ordered in on interlibrary loan and left with about 8 more books - a couple of really interesting looking gardening books amongst them.
Now you've got me wondering about one of my favourite rollicking yarn type authors - I can't recall if she wrote abut Santa Monica or some other west coastal area.
Just did a google - it was Santa Teresa she writes about.
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On Wednesday, June 11, 2014 9:57:25 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:

to very big city, Los Angeles. Yeah, we have sidewalks, traffic lights; th e whole enchilada. But plenty of places to walk, esp. the sea cliff Promena de.

walking groups. Partly social, I would assume? But in this nice climate, why walk indoors?)

ity Council, resulting in even more traffic, also from people coming in fro m outside to work in high tech, medical, other (it's a desirable area). I' ll often walk downtown or if backpack overloaded,take the bus,just not to d eal with parking.

sidewalks! I kid you not! Those fortunate souls need never be crude pede strians. I vaguely understand that in the next county the car-oriented, ste rile fortress suburbs often have only driveways; no sidewalks

scribed; just takes determination. I go forth inspired!






I'm not sure there IS such a place. What is author's name?
G.
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On 12/06/2014 3:05 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:

Sorry Higgs, brain fart on my part there as I wasn't very clear. The character lives in Santa Teresa but the real life place is (supposedly) Santa Barbara. The author is Sue Grafton and she writes what is called 'the alphabet series' ('A' is Alibi etc, etc through many books beginning with each letter of the alphabet). They are rollicking yarns - not particularly well written but funny and women in particular seem to enjoy them because the main character is a semi competent female PI who gets in a mess frequently.
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Todd wrote:

Sorry folks I couldn't resist the temptation. I know it's puerile, like tapping on the cage in the reptile house. Todd didn't disappoint, struck out like an Eastern Brown in an ants nest. I'll try not to do it again. He might hurt his nose on the glass.
David
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On 06/10/2014 06:20 AM, David Hare-Scott wrote:

No, you just lost the argument and decided to insult me.
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Yep.
What's easier to accept:
I got poisoned by the food industry, or, I ate too much and I got sick.
--
Dan Espen

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