warning worth repeating

[Pop]

: >brian : >

: : Man, how did humanity ever survive 15 centuries of chests with locking lids? : : scott Same way you did Scott: Pure, unadulterated dumb luck!

[John B]

Yep, Little ones are like greased lightening. Blink and they're into no good or somewhere they shouldn't. Lot's of things in life shouldn't happen, but they do. As my Dad says " Better to be wrong and alive than dead and right" regards John

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 2:26pm (EST-3) [e-mail] doth sayeth: The child was supposedly taking a nap. It was not her own bedroom. She was being taken care of by an aunt. An accident like this would only take minutes. I understand what you are saying. As for you, I've seen your website. Are all of the locks out of the doors and trunks of the junkers in your back yard?

When you don't hear a kid, that's when you get up and check on them.

When my kids were 2 they were into about everything. I don't recall what age they started opening cabinets, but eventually they did. But, at age 2 I don't recall them "lifting", or even "trying" to lift anything but their tooys, even the lid of the wicker chest we used for their toys, and it was light. So, saying, or implying, a 2 yo got a chest lid, that's apparently heavy enough to knock them out, and t then sufficate, them, is not someting I can readily accept. To my mind, it would be more llikely a hand(s) or finger(s) would be very much more likely to get banged than a head. Unless the lid was already open, and the kid cause it to close. But, if that's t he case, no reason it should have been open.

When my kids were laid down for a nap, didn't matter if they were home or not, we'd always check to be sure they were lying down, and not getting into trouble, until they were asleep. And, when they woke up, I don't recall that they didn't make some ssort of noise, alerting us to them being awake, and to check on them.

How old was the babysitter?

As for my website, and junkers, that link has been changed a long time ago, so your recall is inaccurate. Or, if you can still access it, let me know, so I can change it. I don't have any junkers in my back yard. My son does have a Datsun pickup, with a blown engine - which will wind up back on the road, when he gets another engine in it; and, I have my project Dub, with no engine, the plan is, that will also, eventually, wind up on the road. So, neither is a "junker". All other vehicles, including my son's 1952 Buick, run. And, no ,I do not have the locks out of any of them, doors, or trunks. Why should I? They're not junkers, after all. You think a kid is gonna crawl in a locked trunk, and shut it?. Anyway, the only pictures are a couple of old ones of my Dub project car, and one of my donor engine. Oops, almost forgot

- my son recently got a CJ-7, with no engine, that will be his off-road toy. Still no junker, and it's not in the back yard either. Any "junkers" around here get hauled off to, where else?, the junkyard.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 2:50pm (EST-3) [e-mail] doth accuse: Scott, there's something seriously wrong with you posting remarks like this regarding a subject like this. grow up.

I take it he was a bit too blunt for you?

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 6:25pm (EST-1) [e-mail] (todd) doth sayeth: I'm guessing you have no children. Because if you do and you're telling me prior to the age of 3 they have *never* been out of sight of an adult, I'm telling you I don't buy it.

I've got kids - grown now. We always kept an ey on them, when we could. We also learned very early, to listen, when they weren't in eyesight. If the kid is quiet, check, because more than likely, the kid is getting into trouble. That was always called "keeping an eye on your kids". Your dreaming if you expect to keep them from getting hurt; but, hopefully, you can keep them from getting killed.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[George]

Locks. The kind you should have on that cabinet full of poisons under the sink.

[Guess who]

Agreed. And once more ...and I'm merely being curious, not maliscious... does anyone have an actual media reference to this story? He said it was recent, and I've heard not a thing. Frankly, there's a lot of trolling coming out of Ohio just now in other newsgroups. Is this [OP] substantiated fact, or another troll? It's simple enough to verify by the OP sending a reference. You are in the habit of browsing, JT. Perhaps you can find something in the news media ...and this would have been bound to hit the media. I can't find a darned thing.

[Pop]

: : Jana THANKS for sharing. Friend of mine just built a very large Mahogany : blanket chest for a friend family of his, intents to line it with aromatic ceder. : It's got this huge heavy lid on a free flowing piano hinge that could no doubt : kill a kid! ... or a little toddler. : : I will relay your message to him. : : -- : Alex - "newbie_neander" woodworker : cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com : not my site:

I built chests (only two in my lifetime so far) I always thought to use keep-opens and soft foams on the top/bottom of the closing surfaces to protect little finners, but, you know, I didn't go far enough. They're not airtight, but ... that wasn't the point anyway. Fortunately both have lived thru kids growing up around them. But both those kids now have kids; time for some communictions, I think. Thanks; good reminders, terrible way for them to come about.

Pop

[janahartzell]

I apologize for not being more thorough. She was being watched by an aunt and the little girl was taking a nap (or supposedly). Does there really need to be more said? An accident like this only takes a few minutes. I would concider myself a watchful parent but can anyone say they havn't left their child alone in a room while they're taking a nap? The papers are pretty slow around here since the local newspapers only run once a week. It was on the Rochester, MN news channel (KTTC.com). They usually have links to their stories.

[janahartzell]

Actually JOAT, a child or person who is drowning or choking makes no noise at all. Is that too blunt?

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 2:50pm (EST-3) [e-mail] doth burble: Scott, there's something seriously wrong with you posting remarks like this regarding a subject like this. grow up.

I disagree.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 11:20pm (EST+5) [e-mail] (Searcher) amazedly shouts: WOW, =A0=A0Reading this has made me think, I made a blanket chest for my wife a year ago, the lid is recessed. So, if that lid were to drop on my son's hand it surely would be able to break somethingif not worse. Which I dare not think! I am on my way to the store for something that will protect him. He is 4 and I seriously doubt that he could even lift the lid since it is recessed, but nonetheless I am going to "fix" this possible situation. As well as check the toy box in his room. Some things that seem so inocculous really do much harm. THanks for the warning

The kid's 4, which means he's old enough to understand what "no" means. Tell the kid to keep away from the chest, and spank him if he doesn't. Which should be sufficient, but kids today don't react that way. So, get a locking latch, install it, and keep it locked. Either that or keep a check on the kid.

As far as the toy box, you've probably read my views on them. If not, there's someone where in one of my posts in this thread.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 7:12pm [e-mail] (Guess=A0who) doth sayeth: There is something seriously wrong with you posting such news without reference. This would definitely have hit the newspaper or the radio/TV.

I'd also be very interesting in the results of the investigation into this.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Tue, Jan 31, 2006, 6:30pm (EST-1) [e-mail] (todd) avers: The same way we survived without antibiotics and cars without seatbelts and vaccinations and ... well you get the picture. We survived by people having 5 children because 2 of them were going to die from one thing or another prior to childbearing age.

However, I believe there were more that died of disease and illness than from accidents.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[Mike Marlow]

I have no doubt the tragedy occurred Jan, but I do have to wonder about how it happened. It strikes me that a lid heavy enough to cause suffocation would be too heavy for a 2 year old to lift over their head. There must be more to this story than the simple fact that a lid fell on a child's head. Do you have any additional information about this?

[J T]

Feb 1, 2006, 2:28am (EST+5) [e-mail] (Pop) rudely sayeth: Scott, you are the epitomy of rude, crude bad taste and may you burn in hell for your intentional and purposeful ignorance. It takes all kinds to make the world whirl 'round, but we could do without your kind. You are supremely stupid and impotent.

Impotent? And, epitomy?

The younger the kid, the more attendance they need. Some people learn the hard way. Scott didn't say anything probably most of us aren't thinking. I feel about the same, just sai it with more words than him.

Scott, apparently you need to pretty it up for the more delicate types in the group next time.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Wed, Feb 1, 2006, 2:45am (EST+5) [e-mail] (John=A0B) sayeth: Yep, Little ones are like greased lightening. Blink and they're into no good or somewhere they shouldn't. Lot's of things in life shouldn't happen, but they do. As my Dad says " Better to be wrong and alive than dead and right" regards

Never heard that one before. Yep, you do the best you can, and hope it's enough.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[J T]

Wed, Feb 1, 2006, 9:19am [e-mail] (Guess=A0who) sayeth: You are in the habit of browsing, JT. Perhaps you can find something in the news media ...and this would have been bound to hit the media. I can't find a darned thing.

Not exactly my usual type of browsing, but I'll give it a shot. I'm quite curious too, something just doesn't seem right. Maybe comes from watching too many of the real CSI shows, Dr G, North Mission Road, and so on. LOL I don't watch the phoney CSI shows at all any more, except for NCIS - hat's only for its entertainment value. I do love Monk tho. If I come across anything, I'll post it.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.

[jtpr]

I'm disappointed to say the least to see the comments by JT and others on this. The story being true or not has no real bearing on the OP's suggestion. The point is to attempt to provide a safe environment for our children. A man of JT's age should know from experience children do not always do as told, and they cannot be watched 24x7. In fact his own statements support the fact he didn't watch them every moment (looked in on them to make sure they were sleeping) and had to discipline them because they didn't listen. Any one of those events could have led to the result in the OP's story. It only takes 30 seconds of inattention for something tragic to happen. I almost lost a son to drowning in that amount of time. I was fortunate, but it cured me of the sin of saying things like "why weren't they watching them?".

You should know better.

-Jim

[J T]

Wed, Feb 1, 2006, 2:44pm (EST+5) [e-mail] (Pop) sayeth: When I built chests (only two in my lifetime so far) I always thought to use keep-opens and soft foams on the top/bottom of the closing surfaces to protect little finners, but, you know, I didn't go far enough. They're not airtight, but ... that wasn't the point anyway. Fortunately both have lived thru kids growing up around them. But both those kids now have kids; time for some communictions, I think. Thanks; good reminders, terrible way for them to come about.

OK. For big people, chests with locks, and keep them locked around little kids. For little kids, no tops. Among other reasons, a little kid has problems enough just getting toys into a toy box. Or out. The kid definitely does NOT need to try to screw around with a lid at t he same time, definite recipe for frustration at the least and getting hurt. Give the kid a beak, no lid.

For bigger kids, you can put a top on, so it can be used for a seat too - no locking latch - plus air holes, or gap under the top edge. You got a lid on a chest, biggest problem I see is a second kid slamming it down on another kid's head or hands. Or, getting a kid in it, and then sitting on the lid. Make the lid light enough so if a kid does drop it on his/her own head or hands, it isn't gonna cause major damage - and they shoiuld learn from that, and not do it again, no big deal. So, no need for the fancy hinges, etc.

For older kids, that will NOT be climbing in it, you can put a lock on it - again, if little kids around, keep it locked. Again, I don't really see the need of fancy slow hinges, or whatever. By the time, he/she should be coordinated enough to not drop the lid on their own head/hands, and if they do, it isn't gonna do major damage. It'll teach them to be more careful next time. However, if the lid doesn't go back far enough to stand by itself, I will go along with something to hold the lid up. And, supposedly, the kid will be old enough there will be no desires to climb in the chest.

I don't believe that any locks/latches on any chest large enough to get a kid in should automatically latch when closed. That would prevent any kid from getting trapped accidently. Whcih would still not prevent someone from fastening a lock, or putting weights on the lid.

JOAT Shhh... that's the sound of nobody caring what you think.