The REAL Reasons We're Getting Kicked

[George]

We've had so much, for so long, for so little, than we've come to expect anything and everything for nothing.

[Brian Elfert]

I don't have a problem paying more for American made woodworking machinery.

Most of the stuff I would buy isn't made in the USA anymore, or is priced at 5 to 10 times what an import costs.

A Delta or Jet/Powermatic 15" planer is made in Taiwan or China. Powermatic still makes big planers in the USA, but they are big time expensive if you want one with a single phase motor. Lots of big Powermatic stuff shows up on Ebay, but single phase is very rare.

Brian Elfert

[Leon]

I absolutely totally agree. I recall when our fathers and their fathers knew how to make a living and while I am sure that they did complain about the state of the economy and those in government, they did know how to pour piss out of a boot. It used to be that most any man could cut his own yard, change his own flat, change his own oil, repair his house, etc. I see the biggest problem today is that many with college educations feel that it is their given right to have a high paying job and feel that they should be able to sit around, moan, and groan because they have cannot find an equal paying job in their particular field. I say get over it. Learn a different trade and expect the pay that the job is worth.

[Mike]

Seems like no one wants to pay their dues anymore. It's called instant gratification. I'm going to laugh my butt off when these people really need to hustle for a living to keep their aluminum suburbia facades and monster SUV's going. It's going to get real interesting. Invest now in your skills and abilities, learn how to think and do it yourself, the rest comes easy later.

[Charlie Self]

Bigmike notes:

I think the facades are now vinyl.

The SUVs and all large status symbol vehicles may become problems sooner. Word is we'll hit 2 bucks a gallon, without tax increases, on gas this summer and 3 bucks by next summer. You know that whoever's in office wherever is going to try to slow the jump in prices by adding some more excise taxes to put us closer to the European model.

That 8 mpg rig looks just fine at a buck and a quarter a gallon, but is really going to be a status symbol when gas is 3 bucks and higher. Only the truly wealthy (Cheney & Scalia?) will be able to afford to run them.

Charlie Self "A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way." Mark Twain

[TeamCasa]

Amen to both! Dave.

[Brian Elfert]

Fortunately, or unfortunately, a large part of our economy revolves around the automobile.

No politician is going to purposely increase the price of gasoline if he/she can help it. Our economy will tank if automobile sales tumble due to high gas prices.

I do what I can to save on oil. Both of my vehicles burn diesel and one gets over 40 MPG!

Brian Elfert

[Charlie Self]

Yeah. My pick-up gets about 26 mpg (little 4 cylinder, but I can't seem to find all these 32 mpg pick-ups I read about), my car gets about 32 on the road, and I don't think we drive 15,000 miles a year in both. Less than that if we didn't go home every once in a bit, but we do.

Charlie Self "A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way." Mark Twain

[Doug Winterburn]

...and Kerry, Kohl, Rockerfeller, Corzine, Feinstein, Fitzgerald, Lautenberg, Frist, Edwards, Kennedy, Bingaman, Graham, ...

[Larry Blanchard]

That's true, but it's a secondary effect. A lot of our economy revolves around a constantly expanding population and their need for houses, automobiles, etc.. That's why every time the birth rate goes down a notch, the politicians notch up immigration.

I'll be dead and gone by the time the bubble bursts. I hope, I hope.

If there's life after death, I'll find Ponzi and re-kill him :-)

[Tom Watson]

"It will never be easy to be a Roman."

Thomas J. Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.) (Real Email is tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet)

[Tom Watson]

Unfortunately, my 1987 F-150 gets 12.5 mpg on the turnpike (that I ride on every day going to work).

I wish this was not true, but it is.

I'm driving 30 miles each way. That's 15.000 miles a year.

Just for work.

Oy !

Thomas J. Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.) (Real Email is tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet)

[GeeDubb]

Economics say I can't buy something that does what these do and recoup the difference in gas savings though at $3/ gallon it might.

When are they coming out with a hybrid truck?

Gary

[Charlie Self]

They don't have interests in common..er, conflict.

Charlie Self "Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first." Mark Twain

[Leon]

The truly sickening part is that the gasoline is the cheap part of that expense. The round trip considering the initial cost of the vehicle, maintenance, insurance, and gas probably costs you about $21.00 a day.

[Michael Baglio]

Snip, then:

Y'know, Charlie, I've totally stopped believing the gas-price thing. In '98, I could buy gas for about a buck or so. It threatened to go up, then _did_ go up, and everybody went nuts.

For a month or two.

Now it's around $1.50, (50% more (!!!)), and who really gives a crap? When's the last time it even made the list of table topics at the diner down the street? Seems that people just get used to whatever happens and adapt.

Me, I drive an economy car. Granted, I'm fortunate enough that it's a fairly nice econobox, but it's an upper 20s/gallon car just the same. I don't get the impression that SUV owners complain about gas prices for any reason other than they think they have to in order to be socially acceptable amoung us unfortunate po' folk. Which is a hoot to listen to as they wave bye-bye on the way to take Buffy to ballet.

I think I just forgot what my point was. :\

Michael

[Larry Jaques]

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 20:36:06 -0500, Tom Watson brought forth from the murky depths:

What did you find out about costs to put a newer FI V-8 and 4OD tranny in there, Tawm? Like I said, my 1990 F-150 w/ 302 + 4OD is now getting about 18mpg on the open road betwixt NorCal and SoOr via Mt. Shasta.

Vay!

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[Roy Smith]

I find this thread fascinating. People are saying it's fine to drive gas guzzlers because the cost of a new more fuel efficient car can't be justified by the savings in gas.

At the same time, we've got threads going lamenting the fact that Pentair is selling off Delta and the assumption that this will mean shipping manufacturing jobs overseas, and we should all buy American. One guy wants to know if his "Made in USA" router is really made here or just assembled here.

Well, gee guys, where do you think oil comes from? Most of ours is imported. Kuwait. Mexico. Venezuela. People get bent out of shape if you buy a Japanese car, but it's perfectly OK to burn 3 times more Kuwaiti oil in your Detroit gas guzzler than you would in a Japanese econobox.

For what it's worth, I drive a Chevy Metro which gets 30-something miles per gallon. I'm the gas hog in the family; my wife's Prius gets 45. If we all had averaged 38 MPG for the past 30 years, I be we wouldn't have fought 2 wars in Iraq in the last 10.

OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.

[gabriel]

This is not true. A population with a latrge number of non-workers (ie, not contributing towards GDP), and I'm talking retirees, _depends_ on youth. If the population is not repopulating itself (ie, having kids) fast enough, while the old people are living longer, then the burden of the old non workers overwhelms the power of the working population (ie, the kids people had) to support them (read: Social Security and other government expenses of the old non-workers).

The solution? Force-feed youth into the population through immigration. It is the only way, since the locals are not having enough kids.

There is a huge problem, for example, in Europe, where the aging population is not having enough kids. It is a well-known fact around economist circles that Europe has to get massive immigration to counter this.

China and India, in contrast, has a lot of youth. It is to their advantage to break down their trade barriers to allow those people to do the work locally (ie, "Made in China" exports to the USA, etc...) rather than have massive emmigration to Europe and the USA (who, to a lesser extent than Europe, also has an average age of resident rising too fast).

Let's hope politicians do what they should do. Social Security will be out of funds by 2042 (if I remember correctly).

[Mark]

The locals are having children, but these children don't want to work in the entry level jobs. Somehow they believe they are entitled to start someplace other than the bottom.