Running a 240 volt line

[Tom M.]

I'm in the process of having a home built (my first) and am thinking about having a 240 volt line wired in. To do this I have to pay $200 for a change order fee (added BS) plus the cost of wiring it in I suppose. I was wondering if it is possible to have it wired in later on, and approximately what it would cost to do so. I appears the power wires are underground, since I don't see any poles in the area. The contractor said something to the effect that if it were done later it wouldn't be covered, or would void the house warranty (electrical part, I assume). So my question is, does paying the $200 sound reasonable, or wait and pay later. At the moment, the only tool I have that can be switched to 240 v is my bandsaw, but I'm planning ahead in case I get that cabinet saw. Also, my shop will initially be in the garage, but I plan to build a shop in the back yard someday and will have to have power run to the building anyway.

Thanks, Tom

[Greg]

If you are really thinking about this, price adding several extra outlets. You might find there is a significant economy of scale. You will only pay the $200 once and the outlets will be priced based on labor and materials(plus profit.) The $200 is to cover the paperwork, including filing a modified electrical permit. These are usually priced, based on the number of switches and outlets. Builders usually don't like to get caught cheating the building permit folks out of fees. It makes the inspectors cranky. ;-)

If you call an electrician later you will have a trip charge and the materials, labor and profit is likely to be higher. It may also affect the warranty on the house.

[Toller]

All houses have 240v, so certainly it can be done later. Where is the breaker box with respect to the garage? That will determine what it will cost to run a circuit there.

What you do now will have no effect on what it costs to run a circuit to the new workshop later on, so if you won't need 240 until then, it would be a waste to do anything now.

[Bill Price]

Your clothes dryer runs on 240v, so your home had better come wired for it.

[Bernard Randall]

Are you saying that the house is only being supplied with a single 110V rail and neutral. Ask the contractor how you are to run cookers, stove tops, water heaters and washing machines, they all run off 220V. Not being a native of the US I don't know all your regs, but all the houses I've seen are supplied with 2 110V rails, anti phase and neutral, its not a true 3 phase supply otherwise you would get 155V p/p.

Or are you saying that it would cost an additional $200 to run it to where you specify?

When you eventually complete your shop, some of the medium size DCs are also dual voltage and pull a hell of a starting current due to the size and mass of the impeller, also depending where you live you might want a shop AC as well...

Just food for thought.

Bernard R

[Edwin Pawlowski]

Yes, it is BS, but considering the price of a new house, it is very little to do it right.

You will have 240 coming in from the street to the panel. The added cost and potential problems are dependent on the location of the panel and the location of the proposed outlet. If the panle is on the same wall but on the opposite side, it is a simple job that takes 20 minutes. If the wire has to be fished through finished areas, it can tae a day and cost far more that what it will cost now.

Talk to the electrician. It may be better to have a sub panel put in the present shop that can be carried to the new shop at a later date. I'm not up on all the codes for something like that, but he should be. It could save you a bundle later if you prepare now. Again, this depends on location of the power feeds, etc. A sub panel in the shop is better than just having a 240 line anyway. You can have the entire shop on a panel right in the work area instead of having to traipse sawdust through the house to reset a breaker. Ed [e-mail]

[Toller]

155v?! How do you figure that? Is 208v just an expression? Where the hell are you from that the houses get 110v, and why don't you go back there? In the US houses have to get 120v.

Geez, if you bothered to read the OP you would know that is strictly for the change order; the work is extra.

Well, it is food that has been digested.

[Bernard Randall]

Thank you for the correction on the 208V, a mental aberation on my part.

As far as the 110V is concerned the following is an extract from the Electrical Wiring FAQ Part 1. "One thing where things might get a bit confusing is the different numbers people bandy about for the voltage of a circuit. One person might talk about

110V, another 117V or another 120V. These are all, in fact, exactly the same thing... In North America the utility companies are required to supply a split-phase 240 volt (+-5%) feed to your house. This works out as two 120V +- 5% legs. ...... This FAQ has chosen to be consistent with calling them "110V" and "220V", except when actually saying what the measured voltage will be."

I merely go along with your own convertions.

Bernard R

[GARY]

I would ALWAYS think about possible future plans when buildling. Add extra outlets, etc. It could avoid tearing out a wall or digging another trench. $200 doesn't sound especially bad.

Gary

[Doug Miller]

It's certainly less expensive to have the electrician run that circuit now at the same time that he's installing everything else (i.e. during electrical rough-in, *before* the drywall goes up), than it will be to have him do it later *after* the drywall is up.

-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com

[Montyhp]

I would have 4 put in and make sure that the electrician uses standard sockets so you can buy the plugs at the Borg. (cabinet saw, jointer, planer, bandsaw. You may not have all of these now, but you'll kick yourself later on if you upgrade.)

Montyhp

[Roy Smith]

There's a whole bunch of different style sockets used for 220V service. You need to give the electrician something better than "standard socket". If that's all you tell him, he'll have to guess what you mean and you may not be happy with his guess.

My guess is that you want a 6-20R, which is a grounded 20 amp 2-pole (i.e. 220V) outlet which will accept both 6-20P (20 amp) and 6-15P (15 amp) plugs. The 6-15P is (in my experience) the most likely plug you're going to find on a 220V machine up to about 3HP intended for the consumer or low-end industrial market.

But, the real answer is to look at the specs for the machines you're interested in having and seeing what kind of plugs they come with. If you don't understand the specs, sit down with your electrician, show him all the spec sheets, and say, "I want outlets I can plug these things into".

[Toller]

So, the FAQ (whatever that is) states it is really 120v, and never 110v (as that is more than 5% out of spec), yet choses to use an incorrect term.

You, knowing the FAQ is wrong, choose to follow it's error.

So how does it become MY convertion? And, just what is a convertion?

[Edwin Pawlowski]

For many years, the house voltage was quoted a 110/220. I have no idea why it would have been that way, but that is what Philadelphia Electric called it and what I called it for many years. Still do actually. Has there been any changes in what the power companies supply over the years?

I see motors are rated as 115/230. Why would they rate them at those voltages if the 120/240 is the standard?

Why are incandescent lamps sometimes rated as 120/130 volts? Do you have to rewire the filament to the supplied voltage? ;) Ed

[Toller]

I posted a similar question to alt.home.repair a couple years ago. Some people said that voltage actually used to be lower years ago and has only recently been standardized on 120v. Others said that motors frequently encounter large voltage drops, so they are designed to work at 115v. Beyond that, your guess is a good as mine.

[Phisherman]

[Nova]

Mine didn't.

-- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)

[Joe Wells]

Didn't have 240v to your breaker/fuse box, or didn't have a 240v circuit wired? Big difference.

[Nova]

I didn't have 240V from the pole to the house. It's not uncommon in old homes.

-- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)

[Roy Smith]

The house I grew up in (suburban NJ) was build in the 1950's. It only had 110V service.