left tilt saw and measuring

[Kevin]

Have any of you with left tilt saws found the fact that the flange reference is on the left side vs right side a problem?

I guess this would be an issue with using dado blades or when switching from regular kerf to thin kerf. You'd have to dial in the fence for each blade. In the case of dadoes maybe you just reference the left cutting edge---mmm.. but that's actually going to be an 1/8" off assuming your using a regular kerf blade or 3/32nd for a thin kerf. That starts to get ugly.

I guess the tilting might also need to be taken into account, though I'm not sure it makes any difference if it's right vs left tilt. I don't do enough beveled cuts to remember if on my right tilt saw if either the short or long edge of the cut is referenced to my fence reading.

It kinda seems to me with a right side extension table and fence measurements, a right tilt saw is best (from a consistency of measure perspective).

[Chris Friesen]

Kevin wrote: > Have any of you with left tilt saws found the fact that the flange reference > is on the left side vs right side a problem? >

I almost never use thin-kerf blades, so it isn't really an issue. Dado sets get measured to the fence or buried in a sacrificial fence.

For bevel cuts you generally want the blade to tilt away from the fence for safety, so you have the same measurement issue with either tilt direction.

Chris

[Joe]

Regarding the safety point: As an example, imagine the kickback that could be generated from the following:

Second bevel cut on a board on the opposite edge of the first bevel cut. First bevel cut begins to slip under the rip fence Now the board is trapped on three sides, left, right and top, as the blade is tilted toward the fence, and to finish the cut, the back of the board needs to move out from under the fence and toward the blade.

Nastiest case of kickback I could imagine and I wouldn't even want to be in the room if it happened.

[dpb]

...

Why is it any different an issue at all?

Left tilt is the _one_true_way_, anyway, so any difference is solely ascribed to the RT anomoly... :)

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[B A R R Y]

It is.

I've owned both, and you get used to it.

[Leon]

With left tilt saws dado/thicker blades become wider in the direction towards the fence. This throws off the fence measurement. Typically right tilts stack away from the fence and do not affect the fence scale.

[Leon]

I have a left tilt and this measurement situation only comes in to play when I use a dado set. I NEVER use thin kerf blades any more. The left tilts have several small and big advantages that out weigh this situation IMHO, especially if you are right handed.

[Kevin]

What seems error prone on a LT w/ dado is the fact that your fence is referencing the right side cutting edge of a regular kerf blade. 1/8" of cut is to the left of that point. Now when you stack on the dado, you are widening the cut to the right of there. So your fence reference point is actually 1/8" from the left side of the groove/rabbet. Basically I guess the rule to remember on a LT w/ dado is the cut line begins 1/8" to the left of where the fence reads.

With a RT, you know the fence is reading true to the right-hand side of the groove. In a LT situation you have to account for the 1/8" and thickness of dado.

I guess if one does a lot of dadoes either 1) they opt for RT or 2) they learn the procedure to adjust

Another poster resolved one issue by saying use only reg kerf blades. I wonder if Forrest will swap a new reg. kerf blade for the thin kerf one I still have in the box.

[Swingman]

"Kevin" wrote

Best not to do any"accounting" at all ... that would be error prone as all get out, especially when you start adding shims to a dado stack. :)

Good habit to get into with any table saw cut, regardless of left or right tilt, is to ALWAYS verify the blade to fence setting with your project tape measure.

Besides verifying the correct width of cut, it also verifies that you indeed set the fence correctly ... something the resident shop dummy here has been known to do, without any help whatsoever.

... funny how the air turns blue whenever that happens on that last piece of figured, high dollar wood!

DAMHIKT

[Leon]

HUH? The thing to remember when using a dado set on a LT is to simply measure between the fence and the right most blade with a tape measure.

Not!

[Leon]

Not, as in , just use a tape measure. ;~)

[dpb]

'Pends on which side the fence is on... :)

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[George]

Folding rule. Amazing how a convenience - having a tape on the fence - has become a necessity, what? The most important thing to remember with either tilt is to make sure your measurement to the inside is not identical to the measurment on your drawing for the outside of the dado.

[Kevin]

So why do we have tape measures on the fence guide?

I rarely use a tape measure on my tablesaw. That's the whole point of having a Biesemeyer style fence with integrated rule. Set it once and forget about it.

For the folks still using a rule to setup their saw, then this discussion does not apply.

What next? Should I check the front and rear measurements of the fence? C'mon.. There's only 2 reasons to have a t-square type fence:

1) parallel to the blade at all times 2) integrated ruler

[The Davenport's]

DINGDINGDINGDING!!!!!!!!!!!

Ladies and Gentlemen, We have a winner!

I ___NEVER___ use the scale for anything other than getting sorta-kinda-inakissin'cousin-kinda way close. Then I actually measure from the blade to the fence.

I got into this habit as a kid because the saw that my father had had about the worst POS fence that sears ever put on a saw...but dad never figured he needed more...or that there was better out there, so I couldn't trust the scale at all.

In fact, couldn't trust the thing to clamp straight, either.

Mike

[Jim Weisgram]

I always have considered the tape on the fence rail to be a convenience, not a precision measurement.

I don't consider using a tape measure to check the distance to be a precision measurement either, but generally better than reading from the scale on the table saw.

[DonkeyHody]

I felt that way too until I got a Biesemeyer fence. Its tape and hairline cursor are MUCH more precise than a tape or rule, and faster & easier to read too. I've checked the width of ripped pieces with a dial caliper and consistently found them to be within 0.01 inch of the intended width. Maybe you can do that with a tape, but I can't.

DonkeyHody "I'd rather expect the best of people and be wrong than expect the worst and be right."

[Doug Winterburn]

I've found the same to be true even on my Ridgid TS3650 stock fence.

[Swingman]

"Kevin" wrote

Mine is a Uni-fence on a Unisaw ... it is precision personified, and the fence ruler happens to correspond _perfectly_ to my two favorite Stanley 12' rulers, a rare and happy circumstance in the shop and one to take every advantage of, and to cherish til death do us part.

HOWEVER, the operator is often NOT precision personified ... he has been known to set the fence to 23 3/8" instead of the required 23 5/8", or somesuch ... and on more than one occasion.

Therefore, and when working with expen$ive wood, the requirement to verify, verify ... and verify again.

... nuff said.

(Maybe you just haven't reached that "certain" age?)

[Leon]

ding dong? You need a better fence. I measured for some 13 or so years and could not wait to simply depend on the fence scale. For the last 10 years I have been using 2 different Jet fences, Bies clones. Both were repeatable accurate. I only use the tape measure when using something that cuts wider than 1/8" or when cutting bevel cuts.