Dead or Severely Wounded Jet JTAS-10XL saw - could use some advice....

[Roy]

Here's the situation:

Bought a used (blue) Jet cabinet saw a couple of months ago. The owner was moving and had the saw in a/c storage for 2-3 months before I got it, but it was running fine when he put it in storage (we've been exchanging phone messages today). It set in a/c storage for another couple of months until I had time to make some room in the gara-shop.

Ok, so this afternoon I finished hooking up the 220v circuit - a single outlet,

30A circuit, 10guage wire. The saw came with 14 ga cord, 25 ft long, which is per the Jet manual, but is the minimum. I will replace this with 12 gauge.

Tested the circuit before plugging the saw in. Two hots and a neutral per my light tester. Plug saw in, hit green start button, and nothing. Checked the new 30A plug to make sure black to black, white to white, neutral to neutral aligned at the outlet. All ok.

Pulled the cover to the switch (clean inside), plugged the saw back in, and have two hots and a neutral at the inlet to the switch. Had SWMBO hold in the green button with a stick, and checked the black and white to the neutral on the outlet side of the switch. No light, not even a flicker.

Read manual, and tried to reset the switch via holding in the "stop" button. No click, no reset, no help.

This is my first magnetic switch. Are these switches supposed to have a "click" or some sort of latching feel when you hit the ON button? This just pushes in, and then springs right back. No click or feel of any kind.

I found a place on the web to get a replacement switch, but it was $143 and change, plus shipping. I would appreciate any money-saving suggestions to help get this critter up and running. I am not an electrician, even if I do play one on TV.

Thanks for any help.

Roy

[Lew Hodgett]

Roy wrote: > Here's the situation: >

What is the data on the motor nameplate?

Voltage, phase, amperage, safety factor, etc, etc.

Lew

[Toller]

I don't know anything about the Jet, but it would be unusual for it to need a neutral. Are you sure about that. Perhaps they exist, but I have never seen a tester for 240v. What are you using? What is the H-H and H-N voltage?

My magnetic switch doesn't make any sound (at least none I can hear over the motor), but I expect some do.

[Roy]

Original motor: 3hp, 220v, 14.5 amp, 3450 rpm, single phase, Class E, 60degC. I'll have to check the service factor tomorrow. Thanks.

[Roy]

All I had today was a tester light, so was only checking for whether there was a completed circuit or not.

Thanks - Roy

[Lew Hodgett]

Have you checked the motor for an overload reset button?

If present, will be on the back of the motor, probably near the terminal box.

Lew

[Mike_in_SD]

[e-mail] (Toller) wrote in :

hmmm not sure how you can get 240 with just two wires .. I would say he needs the ground(neutral)

mike

[DG]

I'm assuming that by neutral, you actually mean ground. Different animals, although they eventually connect together in the main panel. Make sure you are connecting to the GROUND bus in the panel, NOT the neutral.

The ground connection is irrelevant while performing the following tests - do not consider it. But don't short anything to it either. ;-)

If the motor is not running, you should be able to hear the clicking of relay contacts in the magnetic switch. Normally you can not due to motor noise.

I would check first for the Thermal Reset Switch on the motor. Usually a red button on the back end of the motor.

If you do not hear any clicking from the controller, use your Neon Tester/VOM/DVM to check for 220 vac across the hot terminals which feed AC to the controller. If not there, check your wiring/cords.

If that is OK, check for 220vac on the terminals which feed the motor while pressing START. If there is no voltage present, you have a dysfunctional controller.

If there is voltage present, check at the motor terminals. If you have power there, you obviously have a bad motor.

The controller can be repaired, but it ain't simple. And yes, they are expensive.

FWIW

[DG]

The ground (NOT neutral) is for equipment grounding/safety. It is not a current carrying conductor. But you DO need it.

220 is derived from the two 180 degree out of phase legs of a residential single phase AC feed. Each leg to neutral being 110/115/120/125 and across both legs being 220/230/240/250.

FWIW

[Prometheus]

"click" or some sort of

springs right back. No

change, plus shipping.

running. I am not

If it were mine, I think I'd try replacing the magnetic switch with a light switch that can handle the load to see if it works. If it works with a different swich, then I'd pony up the money for a replacement, but probably not before establishing that the switch is really the problem.

[Gerald Ross]

moving and had the saw

put it in storage

another couple of months

outlet, 30A circuit, 10guage

but is the minimum. I

light tester. Plug

sure black to black,

have two hots and a

stick, and checked

light, not even a flicker.

No click, no reset, no

"click" or some sort of

springs right back. No

change, plus shipping.

and running. I am not

One more test you need to do before buying a new switch. Buy or borrow a METER tester and check for 220 v between Hot and Hot lines. Since this is a new outlet setup, that should not be assumed just because each side is hot in relation to the neutral.

[David Merrill]

If, in the end, you do need a new magnetic switch, Grizzly offers a 220 v, single phase, 3 HP switch for $60. No personal experience with it.

Merrill

[Bruce Barnett]

Are the two hots different phases?

[Nova]

Definitely, especially if its an older house. The service may only be

110 V.

[Jim Behning]

down on the page and it show the 120/240 circuit.

[Roy]

THANKS!!! to everyone who responded and offered suggestions. You got me going in the right direction.

Came home from work voltmeter in hand, and started tracing voltages. Had 110 on individual leads to ground, but zero across hot to hot across the breaker on the subpanel. I decided the breaker had to be bad so pulled it. I lost my balance as I set it on a lumber shelf, and ended up with my head against the wall looking at the left side of the third breaker on the top row. There was an insulator right down the middle of the box. Turns out the only way to get 220v on the box is to use positions 3 and 4 on each row. I've never come across that before, but I obviously don't do wiring for a living. Damn near knocked myself out slapping myself on the forehead once I realized how simple the solution was. Pretty obvious to me now.

It's a Federal Pacific box and breakers. Aside from the safety concerns with FP, I still need another 220v breaker. I plan to upgrade to a Square-D subpanel on Saturday.

The saw runs great by the way. Thanks again for all the help, gang.

Regards, Roy

moving and had the saw

put it in storage

another couple of months

30A circuit, 10guage

but is the minimum. I

light tester. Plug

sure black to black,

have two hots and a

stick, and checked

not even a flicker.

No click, no reset, no

"click" or some sort of

springs right back. No

change, plus shipping.

running. I am not

[Lew Hodgett]

Roy wrote: > THANKS!!! to everyone who responded and offered suggestions. You got me going in the right > direction. >

SFWIW, c'bkr spacing is dictated by the max number of c'bkrs of a particular voltage.

When you replace your sub panel get a 125A main lug only panel,

12P(full size)/24P(half size) c'bkr spaces, then add a 2P-60A main c'bkr kit along with an insulated ground bar.

Sq Duck uses smaller width bkr case than others, but I been away from it too long to remember exactly what it is.

Have fun.

Lew

[Swingman]

220v on the box is to use

obviously don't do wiring

Don't feel bad ... even those who do still fall in that trap. I've had electricians merrily wire 220v circuits with both hots from the same leg when using these half height breakers. AAMOF, it's happened so often that it is now is an item on my checklist when doing punch-out on a new house.

[LRod]

FP, I still need

Get the QO line of Square D stuff. The Homeline (or whatever they call it) isn't near as robust (still better than FP, though). QO costs a little more but worth it.