book recall... a bit OT or not...

Since there are frequently discussions about electrical wiring here maybe it's not OT?

I thought this was kind of amusing... in twisted kind of way. ;~)

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951,000 units... wonder how many projects went bad??

Reply to
John Grossbohlin
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Wow! Wonder if the lawyers are lining up?

Don't recall a book recall, ever. Lowes, Sunset, clear back to 1975!

And a full refund! There'll be a run on e-bay, Amazon and used book stores ...

Reply to
LDosser

You would think that with that many sales, they would make sure the information is correct and safe. Apparently not.

Look at those numbers, somebody made some money here. Those books go straight to the shelf. I bet not that many are still around.

Reply to
Lee Michaels

Also took them 35 years to figure out that they were passing bad info.

Reply to
CW

On Sat, 9 Jan 2010 02:09:54 -0800, "CW"

And, have to wonder how many injuries, deaths or fire destroyed homes happened in those 35 years due to these book errors?

Is there a time limitation on lawsuits for this kind of error?

Reply to
upscale

"Incidents/Injuries: None reported"

Can't even say "It's for the children" because the children have all grown up and have children of their own.

Reply to
HeyBub

"Caution! The Surgeon General Has Determined That Electricity Can Be A Hazard To Your Health - Do Not Use If Pregnant"

Is missing?

Reply to
Swingman

Yeah ... you can't be too careful with "polarity"? :(

Reply to
Swingman

Wonder what, specifically, was the error?

Possibly simply not consistent w/ current NEC and somebody got their knickers in a wad?

Trying to imagine what would be so flagrantly wrong that could justify such a recall but not be obvious enough it simply wouldn't have worked in reality, anyway.

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Reply to
dpb

Here's an example of that, from my first house, discovered when I remodeled the bathroom. Entire house was wired with BX. Medicine cabinet in bathroom had fluorescent lights and an outlet for plugging in an electric razor. Lights controlled by wall switch, outlet hot all the time. Only one 14-2 BX cable entering the medicine cabinet -- it had been wired using the cable armor as the neutral. Worked, but obviously hazardous.

Reply to
Doug Miller

What was the neutral of the cable used for?

But did the subject book show/recommend such an installation is the question?

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Reply to
dpb

IIRC, BX cable used to not have a neutral. Two wires. Some may have, but I never saw it. A friend once told me that knob and tube wiring was the safest ever, even though it never ran a neutral. I dunno, but I worked with it once and it's an eerie experience in some ways.

The later stuff comes from poor research, using secondary, tertiary and even further back sources as if they were original research. In other words, one guy made the goof in '75, and all the others picked it up from there. You can almost bet on that. Too under-budgeted originally to check the NEC for whatever it was. No complaints for

10-15-20-25-30 years, so it MUST be OK. Only it's not.
Reply to
Charlie Self

That happens a lot.

Dr. Melik: This morning for breakfast he requested something called "wheat germ, organic honey and tiger's milk." Dr. Aragon: [chuckling] Oh, yes. Those are the charmed substances that some years ago were thought to contain life-preserving properties. Dr. Melik: You mean there was no deep fat? No steak or cream pies or... hot fudge? Dr. Aragon: Those were thought to be unhealthy... precisely the opposite of what we now know to be true. Dr. Melik: Incredible.

- from Woody Allen's movie, Sleeper

R
Reply to
RicodJour

The white wire was used for the switched hot to the lights, and the black wire for the unswitched hot to the outlet.

I have no idea. You indicated you were having difficulty imagining something so flagrantly wrong as to justify a recall that would still work in reality; I provided an example from personal experience of just that: something flagrantly wrong that worked in reality.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Of course it did.

Right, one hot and one neutral.

*All* circuits have a neutral, regardless of wiring method. In North America, anyway. The UK has some sort of unusual setup that I don't pretend to understand.

You appear to be confusing neutral with ground.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Doug Miller wrote: ...

No, I was trying to imagine something that would have been _published_in_the_book_under_question_ that would be so (since the thread was about the recall I presumed that would be the obvious context w/o saying so absolutely specifically. I know, it's usenet... :( )

Reply to
dpb

Do you mean no ground wire? I know that BX cable was used for the ground connection in the past, but was it really used in the "return" current path of the neutral?

Reply to
Robert Haar

On Fri, 8 Jan 2010 23:35:26 -0500, the infamous "John Grossbohlin" scrawled the following:

I have one of the books they're recalling and see absolutely nothing in it which could be construed as bad or dangerous wiring advice. The Sunset _Complete Patios_ book had one pic showing direct-bury low-voltage cable, as it is normally installed, GFCI breakers and receptacles. It also had several paragraphs paraphrasing code requirements for keeping transformers at least a foot off the ground. I have no idea what caused the recall of that particular book.

WTF,O? Freakin' Nanny State.

When I'm King, Darwin will be re-released and the stupid shall get their just rewards. Look at the foolish society that attorneys have created.

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Reply to
Larry Jaques

On Sat, 09 Jan 2010 05:18:54 -0500, the infamous snipped-for-privacy@teksavvy.com scrawled the following:

The convenient thing for the publisher is that the book burned up with the fire. ;)

I'm thinking that it was a couple idiots who didn't know squat about installing a wire who burned down their garage or something. Some smart attorney decided that he'd make his entire living off this one and the result is a bogus recall and nightmare for the publishers.

As I said, I own one of the recalled books and, as far as I can tell, it is not in error.

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Reply to
Larry Jaques

Larry Jaques wrote: ...

...

Out of curiosity, which version/date of NEC does it reference?

I don't suppose it predate 3-wire circuits being Standard does it?

Undoubtedly it won't have many newer things such as the mandates for GFIs, 4-wire dryer outlets, etc., which would be my guess is the basis.

If that were to be so, seems more than extreme reaction...

Went to CPSC site and followed link to Oxmoor--their FAQ has no information at all on what specifically might be wrong.

There's a follow-up phone number; I'm tempted to call and say I followed their instructions and what specific diagram(s) and instruction(s) are considered so hazardous that they deserve this action so I can find out where I may have erred in following their advice and correct same?

:)

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Reply to
dpb

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