Whatever happened to the testing for flame retardation. When I worked fro a company making tvs, all the critical components were tested by actually trying to set one on fire and even pcbs had a push out rectangle you could batch test with. The most flammable bit of those tvs was the glue holding the veneer to the chipboard cabinets. Yes it was that long ago. They also had to retain an imploding CRT so chards of glass were not accelerated into the user!
Brian
Yes but the point is, the plastic parts used for such things tend to be very well tested, as its an obvious safety critical part. If it melted, for example and flooded the kitchen I doubt that would down well with customers either. Really, saying only use a cold wash is stupid, its either dangerous or its not. They have in effect layed themselves open for retailers to accept the old ones back then take #whirlpool to court over their c*ck up. Brian
snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@googlegroups.com:
If they concentrated on less models, then they could reduce their production costs.
At one time, all plastics in electrical equipment were self extinguishing (bakelite) Now they are not due to the EUSSR CE standards. Now we have lots of electrical stuff made with highly flammable thermo-plastics. Enables stuff to be made far more cheaply.
Portable appliances, consumer units sockets etc all burn nowadays whereas previously they didn't. They just went black and made a nasty smell.
So? How do you expect free-to-access on-line newspapers to pay for themselves?
The door interlocks, which I believe are the problem, are similar in operation across many machines. I'm not defending Whirlpool- having had issues with one of their fridge/freezers in the past (about 30 years back so not the current round) I'm no fan of theirs, although they did respond well after a complaint to their CEO BUT I'd not be surprised if similar parts are used in other machines which haven't been identified yet by other manufacturers*.
Also, in fairness to Whirlpool, the scale of this problem is massive. Their logistic system simply isn't designed to cope with this scale of refit etc.
People are, perhaps understandably, concerned after Grenfell etc, but just how many incidents have there been across the units in operation?
*When you buy parts to repair appliances yourself, you often find they are common to a number of machines which aren't simply 'badged' versions of the same basic beast.
They're probably all the same basic machine with different plastics on the outside and different firmware settings on the inside ...
Which standards are you referring to? My experience of designing to recent EU standards (which are mostly now harmonised with USA and other national standards) is that there is a great deal of attention to the prevention of fire and its containment should it occur. For example, anything close to a potential ignition source generally needs to meet flammability standard ULV0 or equivalent. There is a lot of detail about sizes of apertures in enclosures which might allow flames or molten burning plastics to escape. Reputable test labs will, if they consider it necessary, follow the paper trail for the materials used. In one instance a PCB insulating spacer was made in China and had no markings because it was just a bare board. Intertek required us to provide documentation from the Chinese board manufacturer about the source and certification of the resin used to manufacture the PCB before accepting its flammability rating.
John
Which bits of the machine were burning so fiercely?
Perhaps they have timed it to avoid that? All the machines involved are
2018 or earlier. Retailers will be reluctant to get involved on machines over a year old.
Love it! Was it you also blaming the EU for Grenfell Tower, even though other EU countries have avoided cladding tower blocks with fire lighters?
Bakelite has not been in use since the 1950s.
Grenfell was a case of the rules not being applied, not the rules not existing.
Anyone who has travelled and lived on the continet will be aware that UK safety standards are higher than European in most cases.
They don't have a choice.
Whirlpool have admitted the fault was present at the time of sale, and consumers can sue the retailer for up to six years after purchase. It will be difficult for a retailer to defend a claim.
Owain
Under the CRA15, the retailer has the option of carrying out a repair, which of course is exactly what Whirlpool is offering to do.
Good note!
Andy Burns snipped-for-privacy@andyburns.uk wrote in news:h5ucubFa5o4U1 @mid.individual.net:
I still think they are using design reousrces on trivial model changes when they should be working on sourcing and specifying components that are thoroughly tested to be up to the job.
You mean the evil EUSSR forced us to have higher safety standard red tape than they set for themselves?
You might be right:
<quote>Miss Flint, from Telford, Shropshire, who had her machine for two-and-a-half years without any previous problems, added: 'The washing machine was on spin and it just suddenly blew up.
'I just heard shattering glass and, when I looked, there was steam coming out of it.' </quote>
<q>'At some point the washing machine drum came apart and sent its load up through the top of the washing machine and destroyed a good chunk of the kitchen. </q>
I had assumed steam buildup was a cause, but maybe just a side effect?
It seems this is what comes of excessive value-engineering, and then so commoditising the machines that there's no support network to modify them after-sales. Their standard business model just assumes you'll buy another one when it breaks, which doesn't work so well for recalls...
Theo
Rather than "Whirlpool recall", I suggest "Forget Whirlpool".
Given the liability of retailers, I wonder if any are having to consider totally dropping their brands because they cannot afford the public liability insurance demands if they continue to sell them?
They should include only just enough adverts to cover the production costs, not as much as they think they can get away with.
And avoid nuisance ads that cover the text; videos that start playing (whether the sound is turned on or not); using *all* the processor cycles in the complicated bidding system they use to decide which ads to serve up.
They're just greedy.
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