Total newby has urgent query.

[JR.]

Hi all. My electric shower has recently broken (water squirts out of the unit and the heater cuts out) and I have been advised that I need a replacement (the shower was old and is obsolete now, I think i.e. Triton T60). However, I read on the Plumbworld website that electric showers cannot be run off of combination boilers. Then, on contacting various plumbers, I have been told that this is wrong i.e. that if I had an electric installed without problems previously, then I must be able to have one again. However, the combination boiler I now have was installed just prior to the shower breaking - which has added to my concern that Plumbworld may indeed be correct in stating that electric showers cannot run with combi-boilers. Can someone please clarify for me? I don't want to buy a shower only to find that it is unsuitable for my system. John.

[Bob Mannix]

The Triton T60 is an instantaneous electric shower that runs off the cold water main. It has no connection with the boiler in the house, whatever that is, so you can replace it at will**. There is often confusion because of poor terminology. A "power shower" normally refers to something that is electrically pumped, but does not heat the water - it gets its hot water from the domestic hot water system and would not be suitable for use on a combi boiler system. An "instantaneous electric shower" (like the Triton T60) just heats water taken at high pressure from the cold water main. These are generally crap BUT provide a good backup shower in case of failure of the primary system.

** "Part P regulations will not allow you to change the shower, as the work would be classed as being in a bathroom, without having it inspected and certified or done by a recognized person". You should take care if you are tempted to up the power rating, as it is quite possible the existing electrical supply arrangements would be inadequate at the higher rating.

[chris French]

In message , JR. writes

Electric showers just run of the cold water supply they do not have hot supply. The type of HW system should therefore not make a jot of difference.

[Tony Bryer]

Triton showers website is

From the FAQ "If water is leaking from a clear plastic tube at the bottom of the unit, then the Pressure Relief Device (PRD) has been activated. A replacement can be ordered from the Triton Spares department (024 76372222)."

There are a number of T60 variants some of which still have parts available.

[Christian McArdle]

There's always the kettle.

I'd rather have a decent shower the whole year round, minus a couple of days, than have to shower under a pathetic electric, even assuming that the electrical shower will be any more reliable than the combi boiler in the first place.

Christian.

[Homer2911]

mixer recently broke its plasic spindle, squirting water all over the place until I found the isolating valve.

Could Triton supply this tiny part? Could they Buxton! Had to buy a complete new mixer unit from them. Cost? =A3117!

[JR.]

[Owain]

Guidance from the IEE (Wiring Matters, received today) says that:

Q. If I replace an existing electric shower with a new electric shower connected to an existing shower circuit is this notifiable work? A. No, provided the shower is a like for like replacement

Owain

[RichardS]

Hmmm, interesting.

Wonder if swapping a CU with a like-for-like replacement would be similarly non-notifiable?

In which case, proving any non-compliance at sale time would be a complete non-starter.

[John]

Did you really expect anything but a total balls up from ODPM? Lets hope this piece of garbage goes the same way as the poll tax when the public FINALLY wake up to what has been foisted on them.

[Andy Wade]

I was surprised to see that too (my copy also arrived yesterday). Trouble is that "like for like" will get stretched a bit. "The old shower was 6.5 kW and this one's 10.5 kW, but they look similar and it's still a Tr***n so it must be OK. What do you mean 4mm^2 cable might not be quite enough, it was OK before... "

*****

Also of interest is the NAPIT advert on the back for their "just 8" limited Part P scheme, aimed at people working on their own property or doing jobs for friends and relations. This allows you to self-certify up to eight notifications per year for a reduced membership fee (GBP 185 pa, from memory, plus 55 quid for the initial assessment). This still seems expensive though, unless you can use up all eight goes. There don't appear to be any details of it on their web site yet, but I do intend to e-mail them for info.

[Owain]

Exactly.

I wonder if there's a limit to how much work can go one one 'notification'. Would all the work have to be at the same address, for example? Does the work have to be done by a named individual or could eight householders join the scheme in partnership and put in one notification for each household to cover a full rewiring over several years?

Of course, it will make a valuable contribution to safety :-)

Owain

[Andrew Gabriel]

It would be interesting to know if you can point to some work you did pre-Part P for the initial assessment. I would probably point to my consumer unit replacement and outdoor socket provisioning I did a couple of days after Christmas, specifically to beat the Part P deadline.

[Andy Wade]

I'd guess it would cover anything that could be put on one electrical installation certificate (or small works cert.) - definitely one client at one address, surely?

Guessing again, it will will be for work done by the signed-up member.

That's what we've been told, so it must be true.

[Andy Wade]

I'd hope so...

Also I wonder what the requirements with regard to test equipment (and calibration thereof) will be. I do DIY calibration - sanity checks really - using resistors checked on other instruments and comparing three or more instruments against each other. I also have an old HP meter calibrator which seems to provide pretty accurate voltages and currents, but is not itself formally calibrated.

[Andrew Gabriel]

Other than an RCD tester which I made myself, I've hired test equipment when I've needed it, which is presumably a satisfactory answer as it always comes with a calibration certificate.

Interestingly, the flue gas analyser I bought came with a calibration certificate from the manufacturer (Kane), but it has no date on it. The inference seems to be that it's valid for 2 years from the purchase date.

[Nick Atty]

Proving non-compliance at sale time is going to be impossible anyway. I just got a completion certificate for some building work, which essentially says "there was lots of work done on this property in 2004/5 and it is all up to scratch".

As far as I can see, if I do anything else in the next year or so (assuming I do it well, of course) then no-one will ever do the detective work to find out exactly what the original building notice covered.

[Andy Wade]

In the meantime I've e-mailed NAPIT (last Thursday) asking for full details of the just8 scheme, but have yet to receive any reply.