Too many urgent repairs recommanded in Homebuyers report, Should we proceed?

We are in the process of buying a 1930s semi, and yesterday we receive

the homebuyer's report from the surveyer. It recommanded 4 urgen repairs and further few for further investigations.

2) Damp, in the front external wall, chimney, garage and likely in th kitchen walls.

4) repair/upgrade electrical installation.

My questions is, does this sound like the typical condition of a 1930 semi for its age? or this could be a potential money pit that i shoul avoid. What's your experience with recommandations from the Homebuye report? I understand surveyers need to cover themselves fo liabilities. But these urgent repairs just sound like too much work. did have a chat with the surveyer on the phone. only being told he ha seen houses in far worse condition. Should I pull out, or I might mis an opportunity as it could be the fair condition of a 1930s semi what's your thoughts?

Jerr

-- sonningmill

Warning: I have a very low opinion of (most) surveyors.

How is the expenditure on buying the house compared to your financial means? (Don't answer it, think about it) Are you maxing out to buy the house with no money for reserves? Are you planning to stay for sometime?

One way forward may be to return and see (and ideally photograph) the alledged defects.

2) Damp. Why is it damp?

Surveyors are rarely much help in diagnosing the cause of damp, they usually just recommend (often unnecessary) proprietry damp treatments.

Assuming the house was once dry, and is now damp - something that once worked has stopped working (find it, fix it) - or there is a new source of moisture (find it, stop it).

Don't slap on proprietry damp treaments. Most likely is something simple, leaking gutters, steam from cooking/bathrooms that's not properly ventilated, earth piled up outside bridging the damp course. Go and look for the problem.

4) Get an example of what's wrong. Take an electrician round for an estimate. Is it original 1930's wiring? (sockets/switches/fuse box all look old-fashioned - this'll be expensive) Or is just a light pendant somewhere that looks a bit iffy?

Go use your eyes. It's all the surveyor did.

Sound's pretty normal - probably stuff you can mostly ignore until you are ready, though you might need to keep an eye on things esp the subfloor space in case of dry rot. Make an inspection hatch so you can have a look with the aid of mirror and torch. All old buildings are full of defects unless they have been subject to a very unusual level of maintenance.

cheers Jacob

5) Further investigation of all timber defect, as he suspects decay in the wooden floor of entrance hall.

snipped-for-privacy@gglz.com wrote:

If the cause of the damp is due to the state of the chimney and you are active and experienced enough to repair it yourself (it isn't that difficult and if the lead is still available as patterns, could be a pice of cake) you might get a price reduction to make it even more attractive than you originally thought.

If it is the chimney and other stuff covered in the survey it will show different patterns to what you suggest. Ask for further clarification and the OP should at least have looked at the gutters himself.

No it doesn't. It sounds like it is all due to the first part of the survey and that the surveyor has done a good job. A 1930's house might have no cavity thus a leaking roof might bring problems lower down.

They did have damp courses in those days. Check or clarify that this is still sound. In factt he OP is rather vague on what he means: Condensation and insulation, improve sub-floor ventilation by a builder. Doesn't sound like the wording of a survey.

Again this sounds like it could be an asset if the damage is not too severe. The price reduction you might get because of it could get the OP a rewire to suit modern needs and his tastes.

Again if this is cured by fixing the roof the cost should be reflected in the price offered.the vendor.

All told though, it does sound like major renovations. If he has visions of just moving in with some boxes until he's slapped a bit of paint around he will have a shocker.

OTOH, the surveyor never found rot, so what he pointed out might be dirt or the merest trace of a problem. It might be remedied for pennies. He should go and look.

OP:

=A31000 off for the door and floor. =A32000 for the rewire and =A32000 for the wall and chimney.

If you are doing it yourself, half that. Don't accept less if it is as bad as it could be, as you won't be getting the full whack from the mortgage lenders to cover the expenses. You will have to find the capital elsewhere.

And the initial costs are going to be just about the same however much you agree on.

A rather typical sweeping NG comment - so easily written but I would suggest pretty erroneous. Take out the 'old', 'full' and change the 'very unusual' to 'normal' and you get something which is more realistic. Don't kid yourself on that modern houses don't have defects.

I don't do more than normal maintenace on my ca 1800 house and I would challenge anyone to find anything that would upset a surveyor.

Rob

I stand by my sweeping statement! Have been working in and around old buildings for about 40 years and find woodworm, dry rot etc etc everywhere - often a past attack now ceased. 'Normal' levels of house maintenance seemed to stop about 1960 when the DIY trend took off. Cause and effect or coincidence? I'm used to being called in to look at old joinery which hasn't been painted for 50 years - still with thick old lead paint etc - durable stuff but doesn't last forever. I am sure you are right about new building - I have not much experience in that area - I just assume that all new stuff is total crap. That's a sweeping statement based on little experience I admit.

cheers

Jacob

The message from sonningmill contains these words:

I've seen far worse, but if you don't think you can handle it, don't buy it!

3) Condensation and insulation, improve sub-floor ventilation by a builder.

We may be reading the meaning of the OP differently.

The surveyor has concerns about the security of the chimney, you I think are taking that to mean a significant roof leak that is maifesting in several areas of the house.

You are right of course that rain penetration around the chimney (or simply raining inside the chimney, if it's blocked at the bottom and not the top) will usually have a characteristic staining pattern - but as I read it (damp in external wall, chimney, garage) there's multiple exterior leaks (and roof condition wasn't flagged) or there's poor ventilation - which I tied in with 3) (condensation). So if there's no obvious localised problem, I would be checking for high humidity inside that building that's manifesting everywhere.

How is the house being heated?

It sounds like a typical Homebuyers Report. Will the bank (if you've a mortgage) withold money?

Sounds OK - the first thing to consider IMO is the wiring.

Bad points are generally exaggerated. Does the report say the house is worth the money?

"Buy now, fix later" from the report - for more specific advice, be more specific (quote bits of the report, pics. uploaded somewhere would be helpful).

Shouldn't cost a fortune if you find a decent jobbing builder. But it depends on the true condition which is difficult to establish without close inspection. Which I doubt the surveyor did.

Wonder how he measured this damp? Is it obvious to the naked eye? The devices they use for measuring damp are notoriously unreliable.

Condensation could happen in an unoccupied unheated unventilated building. Are any airbricks or ventilators blocked off? Has it older double glazing with no air vents above them? Are any fireplaces blocked up with no ventilation to them?

Insulation - might have non. Insulating the roof is cheap and easy DIY. Cavity wall insulation (if they are cavity walls) more expensive.

A simple job by the above jobbing builder.

You can do some simple checks yourself.

Has the CU got fuses? If so probably old, but the wiring could still be ok. Is all the wiring you can easily see PVC? If so, might be ok. Any sign of rubber or lead and it *will* need re-wiring. (Often the sockets will have newer wiring than the lights) If you can, switch off everything at the main switch(s) and remove a random light switch - just the fixing screws. Check the wiring behind as above. There should be an earth wire attached to a terminal on the backing box. If not, it's over about 40 years old. If there's no standard backing box it may be original.

If the house is empty, lifting a few floorboards to have a look isn't difficult. There are specialist firms that do free quotes, but like all such things get more than one.

There's not much that would put *me* off - if the price is right. It's all fairly minor works. Most of which can be DIY'd - if you have the skills and time.

Not anything there that you wouldn't expect from a property in need of some TLC - although I'd have the timber inspected properly first before making a decision. If there are signs of sagging etc and poor ventilation under floor, all sorts of nasties are possible.

Most people like a house to their own tastes - decoration wise, etc. So paying top dollar for one in perfect condition that you can move straight into doesn't make sense if you're just going to rip it all out in short order. As many do with expensive things like fitted kitchens, etc. Things like rewiring also make sense since an older installation - even if sound

- is unlikely to have enough sockets in the right places, or sophisticated lighting.

But it all comes down to if the price is right. Anything can be fixed at a price.

I agree with you. Just look around and "normal maintenance" *is* very unusual these days. People can't be arsed to look after exterior woodwork so they replace it with uPVC, etc.

It applies to both old and new properties but I would say that older properties, in general, stand up better to the lack of normal maintenance. Of course that may be just because those that didn't stand up, didn't, and we're left with only those that did IYSWIM.

MBQ

Thanks

I think I should try to negotiate the price down on the property. Th asking price is high comparing with other similar properties on th same street, as the house is in good decorative state, we overpaid bit to save the hassle.

Are these jobs sound big job? I've been informed by the surveye repairing the chimney is costly. not sure about the others. before call the builders and electrians in to have a look. any thoughts on ho much its going to cost roughly

-- sonningmill

in short the points below are too ambiguous to really tell. They could be nothing or big work, or anything in between.

likely to be correct, as this can be seen from the ground and is standard maintenance stuff. Chimneys in poor condition are common, as few diyers want to get up there, and few non-diyers pay much attention to them.

Surveyors and damp diagnoses should be regarded with a bucket of salt, with false diagnoses being routine. Damp problems are something you can determine the existence or not of by looking for the various signs of a damp problem.

subfloor ventilation is easy to improve as long as outdoor soil level is below the floor. If not it can sometimes be less straightforward. This just might turn out to be a majorish problem, since lack of ventilation tends to lead to rot of floor and joists. The quickest way to assess this is a bounce test. Up on tiptoes, drop onto heels, and see what happens. If everything in the place shakes and wobbles, and things fall off the table, there may (or may not) be a significant rot problem. This is not an accurate diagnostic test, but is as much as gets done in most purchases, as anything more accurate requires pulling bits of floor up.

Need for insulation is normal.

Condensation: it depends how this conclusion was reached. I'd reassess to see if it can be confirmed or not.

This means almost nothing. HBSs do not include any significant assessment of electricals beyond a glance at the CU and bathroom equi bonding. The comment indicates you dont have the latest CU and equi bonding. The elcetrics could be modern eg 1980s and in A1 condition, or they might be something lethal. If you take a few pics of fusebox, mains socket, cable, light switch and light fiting, we could tell you a lot more.

suspects? Either he found some or didnt. Suspects means he doesnt know!

could be either.

Can learn a lot more by looking round a property oneself. HB just doesnt give enough info or enough reliability to know the condition of a house.

Really we have little idea whether there even are problems. Before doing anything you will need to assess these points properly to find out what if any problem exists. To do anything else would be meaningless.

could be anything Jerry, need to assess properly. If you post us pics of all the concern areas we might be able to help clear this up.

NT

You actually like all the decoration, or it's just clean looking?

Tarting up decorations with a coat of emulsion is one of the oldest tricks in the book for a quick sale. And only costs a very few hundred pounds. It really is no thing to base a house value on.

You need some actual estimates to help you base your new offer on. Showing those to the seller often works wonders.

Have you tried meeting your prospective next-door neighbours? As well as possibly convincing you that you don't want to live within five miles of the place, they could be useful sources of information, as their houses are probably built just like this one.

If it's going to fall off and kill someone, yes that is urgent. But 'making safe' is not the same as repair or reinstatement. Are the chimneys in use? If not, board and wire round them should hold them together for six months.

This is probably one of

a) his damp meter giving its usual useless reading b) pointing and flashing on chimney c) pointing and flashing on bay windows d) overflowing gutters

Unless damp has caused severe damage it's unlikely to be either "urgent" or "catastrophic".

"likely"??

Air bricks and run the heating.

Too vague. It either needs rewiring or it doesn't. If it needs rewiring knock £5k off price, spend £2k on rewiring, smile at £3k profit.

Rain blowing under front door?

It's a 1930s house, it is going to need some care and attention. It is probably also better built than most new builds. Depends on the price, how risk averse you are, and how tight the mortgage is to the valuation.

Owain

The message from "Dave Plowman (News)" contains these words:

Unless you're an estate agent or a TV house make-over programme.

.... or a discerning buyer. Can you still buy that nice shiny tyre black? That adds a few quid to the price of a car, too!