Rough sawn untreated timber

stuart noble wrote:

It is dried to 17%, but then left outside in the rain, usually, in timber yards.
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The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Any decent timber merchant stores it outdoors, but under cover. That's the best way to maintain the moisture content. Only the treated outdoor stuff gets rained on.
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stuart noble wrote:

yes, but the average humidity outside unheated, is higher than the average humidity indoors, heated.
For attic work, they are of course fairly similar.
But internal studwork will always shrink a bit.
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Rough sawn, just means rough sawn. Larger timber sections (e.g. 100*225mm) are usually supplied rough sawn - structural stuff will be kiln-dried and strength graded as well.
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On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 07:28:00 +0000, Tim Watts wrote:

=============================================== Sawn timber is a staple of the building trade for roofing, joists etc. You might do better by ignoring the big name outlets and look for local timber merchants in Yellow Pages. You might still have difficulty getting exact 4" x 2" but most yards will cut larger sections to size at little or no extra cost if you're buying the offcuts as well. This obviously isn't the same as planing down to size so there is little or no waste.
Cic.
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On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 07:28:00 +0000, Tim Watts wrote:

Really? Interesting... I've seen joists attached horizontally plenty of times, but not vertically - wouldn't that be less sound structurally because the 'thin' boards are trying to bend and putting stress on whatever's attaching them together?
I've had the same prob. getting rough stuff this side of t'pond too - all the big places do only dimensional stuff; I'd probably have to go direct to a mill to get anything else. Luckily I only needed about 8', and we had a derelict shed way out back which gave up one of its timbers...
cheers
Jules
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On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 12:31:47 +0000, Jules Richardson

It was done in a few areas where they couldn't trivially get 8x2" in during a loft conversion. I've been beefing them up by plating the sides with ply, but mostly because it is easy now, rather any absolute need - they've been there 30 years.
I'm happy to make an exception to my usual perfectionism and pull the stunt once more to close down a 2' span of the floor boards to something more sensible - there strength is less important as it will be 200mm away from an 8x2 - it just makes the floorboards go "boing" less.

Alsfords said they could take the next size PAR and plane it down to 100x50mm (excatly what I need) but it seems silly as AFAIK the modern PAR that is just down from 100x50 is derived from a bit of sawn 4x2, so why not get the 4x2 in the first place (and Alsfords are expensive).
I could use treated garden stuff, but I'm not sure if I could get a 3.4m length.
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On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 12:55:57 +0000, Tim Watts wrote:

Oh, OK - misunderstood; I thought you were describing boards on their sides to make a 4x4" joist, not an 8x2". I can now go and relax with a coffee, safe in the knowledge that your house isn't going to fall down ;-)

Yeah, sounds like a plan. Do you mean you currently have 2' between existing joists, or that the joist span between supporting structure below is only 2'? The deflection of an 8x2" over only 2' will be sixteen shades of bugger all :-)

Yeah - see if you have any sawmills in your area as you might be able to talk to them direct. As you need so little, they might even just give you what you need...

Check out somewhere that supplies decking materials - they'd have something intended for the sub-structure that was long enough, although I suspect that they might all be dimensional and so not the exact 8x2" that you need. Perhaps worth a phone call, though.
cheers
Jules
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On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:04:12 +0000, Jules Richardson

Hasn't yet, despite the best efforts of various builders! ;-O

2' between one pair of joists - most spacings are either 400mm or 500mm (varies for some reason) which are OK. 600mm on this one pair is causing noticeable bounce in the floor.
However, 150-200 odd mm away from one of the joists, there is a 4x2 ceiling joist that's begging to have another bit of 4x2 glued and screwed down onto it which means all my joist spacings are 500mm or less - which seems to make all the difference.

Only found one mill and they specialise in oak.

Yes - decking's an idea[1]. Haven't researched the sizes yet - and the problem of treated wood rears its head.
I'll try a rummage in the Thompson local and see if there are any timber yards that I haven't found yet.
[1] I've cleared open an old pedestrian path that goes through the hedge on the other end of my land (corner plot). Needs a gate. Reckon I might make a gate out of decking joists (frame) and decking surface - should last forever :)
Cheers
Tim
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Tim Watts wrote:

Last time I looked yes...

Lots of places do CLS now it seems - i.e. sawn but slightly planed with the corners rounded off for safer handling, but plain kiln dried sawn carcassing should still be available.
CLS is often cheaper these days. You could always get the nearest equivalent to 6x2 CLS, and then just rip it to the desired height with a circular saw - the exact width will not matter for this application.
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Tim Watts wrote:

Bats Building Supplies, Strood. I buy loads of 4 x 2 and 6 x 2 for decks. Its sawn price, but so well sawn its as good as B&Q PAR :-)
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Most timber merchanats are moving away from rough sawn ... to regularised or CLS sizes.
My local Jewson have gone this way, but when I wanted some sawn sizes .. they cut them for me.
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On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 20:23:38 +0100, "Rick Hughes"

Interesting - thanks :)
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wrote:

My local TP has gone that way too - all CLS, regularised, no rough sawn, apart from battens. Made it awkward when needing to complete some studwork already begun in 3x2 rough sawn ;-)
Cheers Richard
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