Record deck replacement

It wasn't a problem in practice with 78 rpm tracking at several grams. The later microgroove units had (switchable) muting which killed the output until up to speed.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)
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worth a bit probably today.

To be honest, apart from a sligthly better arm and deck insulation from floor vibration, you have to spend a huge amount more for anything perceptibly better..

More than good enough..

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

301 and 401 were good. SP25?, well...
Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

Never had any with my 301. In those days I had good ears.

Reply to
charles

I've been tortured by too many bottom end Garrard decks to ever forgive them. I've seen people try to make them tolerable by ripping out the autochanger, stuffing foam in the springs, and loads of plasticine under the turntable, but they'll always be garrards.

NT

Reply to
NT

Havent heard of clamping the motor board down before to fix it, and I dont see how it would, it makes no difference to the relationship between motor and idler and turntable platter.

This reminds me of the tape bodges though. In one case I came across an idler wheel with many splits from the centre to the edge, it was so badly damaged that at 16rpm the pin thin motor spindle could sit in a crack. The idler wheel had been wrapped with tape to make it work. I also remember tape wrapping of the motor spindle being used to convert

60Hz decks for 50Hz use.

NT

Reply to
NT

Ah, the Thorens I used lacked that.

NT

Reply to
NT

The Garrard 4-pole "LABORATORY BALANCED MOTOR" labelled "DUAL OR HIGH RANGE - GARRARD ENG. A" is rated at 8W and is the size of my fist. The origins of the design of the idler drive turntables where from the day of heavy tracking, low compliance mono pickups. Their use is desirous, particularly with the singles of 50's and 60's with high modulation levels. Plenty of your toothbrush motor players cannot maintain the speed in the load passages of those highly modulated records. Many recordings have doubtless been disposed of due to underperforming players with lazzy band economics.

Garrard fitted a Goldring G800 to the SP25 idler drive without problem.

Tone arm wiring also plays its effect. It is wise to unbundle the wires and twist the channels seperately. Cartridge and tonearm grounding is not absolutely necessary and varies according to the exact connection details between cartridge and amplifier and the grounding position of the motor board itself. Disconnecting grounding to motor-board and motor is a quick way to remove the grounding currents which upset magnetic pickups.

The only increase in cabinet size would be in height because the drive spindle is designed to work upside and so the belt would have to be lower than the platter.

Although their true value in an as new condition is probably over =A3200, I wouldn't pay more than =A320 for a bare deck without cartridge. I know that with less than an hour of my time, I can get, with a cheap mag cart a most excellent performing instrument. Not forgetting about

10p worth of oil, solder and an O-ring. There have been a few better looking decks over the years, but they were an astronomical price in comparison when new.

The rival to the SP25 idler models and their brethren is not going to be powered by knicker elastic and a toothbrush motor even with a black laquer finish..

Reply to
thirty-six

Are you sure, most motor starts use reactive components to improve starting torque?

Reply to
thirty-six

Good grief. That's a first. Been reading the Russ Andrew's site? ;-)

But in any case who would buy an expensive Thorens turntable then fit it with an ancient pickup?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Last time I looked a bare 301 or 401 was fetching around 400 quid in need of servicing and a paint job. This was a rock bottom price. SP25's are totally undervalued workhorse that can produce hi-fi reproduction given some easy and cheap modifications which take less than an hour. Spares are cheaply available, just buy another. Problem is they are getting thin on the ground.

Reply to
thirty-six

SP25 was not bottom of the range. Their "slimline" model was. There were also a few similar to the SP25 including changers which slightly predate it which omit the antiskate so are unsuitable for a high- compliance pickup. Stiffer foam in the springs does reduce motor rumble and feedback if it's party time. Where exactly would the plasticene go and what was the supposed benefit?

Reply to
thirty-six

Perhaps if your reading ability improved to surpass your technical nouse, your tech knowledge could be enlightened. I get the feeling that you prefer to ignore the information presented which rocks your beliefs.

Reply to
thirty-six

Yes, then you are refering to the cheaper models with an all steel platter and probably 2-pole motor. SP25 (Lab Series) has an outer section of the platter of zinc alloy, which needs no additional weight, and a 4-pole (balanced) motor. The record support is improved by the removal of decorative metal trim and the application of a thin foam.

Apparently there are manufacturers who also consider that an adequate system. Perhaps if I was an angler I could get their joke.

Reply to
thirty-six

Well, most arms do use that method. It works, well if not quite perfectly.

NT

Reply to
NT

The 50s and 60s singles I've seen didnt have high mod levels. 1980s

12" singles OTOH often did.

this is false. Even a rock bottom plastic platter deck with a 6v toy motor isn't slowed down by high groove modulation.

G800 is not a particularly good pickup, IME. But then an idler deck isnt the best either.

The only difference that makes is to reduce crosstalk at upper audio frequencies. I've never heard anyone suggest its a real issue before.

I've never encountered a deck that came anywhere near being usable without the arm being grounded. What other scheme are you proposing to avoid heavy duty hum?

I've not come across it making any difference whether the motor's grounded or not. Many decks are, many arent.

fwiw lots have the motor under the platter, driving an inner rim

idler has no advantage whatever over belt for domestic use. The only plus is startup time. The advantages of belt drive are just basic physics

NT

Reply to
NT

so youre unable to explain how it might work.

Reply to
NT

It's already been presented.

Reply to
thirty-six

No, it hasnt. If you knew how idler wheel decks were put together you wouldnt have suggested it. Move on.

NT

Reply to
NT

is the size of

I see you have nothing more to contribute.

Reply to
NT

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