Re: OT: air india crash

I don't think it is possible. The lock mechanism isn't hidden inside the switch, you can see it, and you can see that it's a sharp V shape. I have tried balancing such a switch on top of the V, and it seems to be impossible. It always fell very positively to one side or other.

Certainly it could never happen accidentally, it would be like tossing a coin and having it land on edge. Two coins, in this case.

Which is exactly why I asked.

There is no reason to move the switches after takeoff, that would have been done before starting the engines because you can't start the engines without doing that and switch action is much too positive to get the effect you are talking about, for a reason. And we have never had any situation where that has ever happened with that particular switch and its unlikely to happen with both switches virtually simultaneously anyway

You aren’t a container , there is little capacity to increase freight and get more of those pesky lorries off the road because the passenger trains are in the way. Move some of the passenger flow to a new line and you free up paths for freight on the older route. The mistake was gold plating the scheme and making a it high speed line like those in Europe where the high speeds attained can eat up the time formerly needed for the long distances between destinations . We don’t need that for most journeys in the relatively small UK . A bit faster than the existing routes would have been fine ,say 150mph rather than the 220 mph HS2 has been designed for. That extra 70 made the scheme very expensive even before the bad management of the project. Properly would have made little difference to the protests from those living on the route, telling them it was essentially a Motorway relief scheme would still have had them up in arms but a slower speed scheme would not have been as expensive to engineer against some of their concerns. GH

Maybe. Around here they seem to have been raising bridges to improve the rail usage (Hi-cube containers) I haven't noticed lots of daytime freight passing through the stations while I'm waiting, but around Lincolnshire they seem to be using many more (and much longer) trains during the day, which isn't popular with locals in towns divided by level-crossings.

For obvious reasons that have been explained for the benefit of those too dim to understand!

If the supply to the switch was interupted - would the switch drop OFF?

Those who have driven in the USA will have waited at crossings while a few big diesels pulled containers past for several minutes. I waited for one I estimated at about a mile and a half long, pulled by five locos. But only one driver.

No, they are purely mechanical. Of course, these days they are only signal inputs to a computer, but I suspect a fair bit of work has been done to minimise computer glitches.

There are no obvious reasons, you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist

Nope, stupidly claimed

Nope, that would be FAR too dangerous

Daily telegraph says the captain did it.

The captain of the crashed Air India jet likely cut off the fuel supply before it crashed in Ahmedabad, US officials believe.

The first officer, who was flying the Boeing 787-9, questioned why the captain had moved switches to the cut-off position, according to a US assessment of the black-box data.

The first officer reportedly expressed surprise and panicked, while the captain remained calm, the Wall Street Journal reported.

All but one of 242 people on board the Boeing 787 Dreamliner were killed when the aircraft plunged into a medical student hostel in a built-up suburb last month, less than a minute after take-off from Ahmedabad airport.

It follows a preliminary report released by Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau’s (AAIB) that found that switches controlling fuel flow to the jet’s two engines were turned off, leading to a catastrophic loss of thrust at take-off.

According to the report, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why “did you cut off” the fuel supply in the recovered cockpit voice recording. The other pilot responded that he “didn’t”.

It was not previously clear who said what. However, sources in the US who have reviewed the cockpit voice recordings told the Wall Street Journal that it was the captain who was questioned about why he cut off fuel to engines.

The switches were moved in succession, one second apart, according to the report. Some 10 seconds later, the switches were turned back on. The report did not say whether the switches may have been turned off accidentally or deliberately.

Sumeet Sabharwal, the captain, and Clive Kundar, the co-pilot had more than 9,000 hours of flying time between them.

On Sunday, The Telegraph revealed that Air India crash investigators are examining the medical records of Mr Sabharwal amid claims that he suffered from depression and mental health problems.

Captain Sabharwal, 56, who had been considering leaving the airline to look after his elderly father following the death of his mother in 2022.

In the moments before the disaster, Mr Sabharwal issued a mayday call. However, after the aircraft reached a maximum altitude of barely 400ft above the runway all contact was lost. The plane then fell towards the ground and exploded on impact.

Campbell Wison, the Air India chief executive, said in a staff memo that the report had “triggered a new round of speculation in the media”.

Mr Wilson said the report identified no cause nor made any recommendations and urged people to avoid drawing premature conclusions as investigation was far from over.

The crash was the first fatal accident involving Boeing’s Dreamliner. However, the airline had already suffered reputational damage after a string of safety and quality problems.

The Dreamliner, which entered service in 2011, is popular among commercial airlines and is commonly used on international long-haul routes.

On 17/07/2025 05:42, GB

Hah. So many times. The trains pack up long before I do even these days.

An evening out in London requires a hotel stay afterwards

Yep. Litigation. Everybody *knows* what happened (except you) but the 'official' sources don't want to actually spell it out for fear of getting sued.

But the Wall Street Journal has broken ranks and so now everybody's story is that 'the wall street journal says' ...'that the captain did it'.

Of course not.

They are probably two pole with two separate signal paths to each switch.

The report limits itself to saying they were physically moved

We have MUCH longer iron ore trains which have FAR more locos and no drivers at all, its all remotely controlled from Petth, thousands of km away

The reason, which was very clearly explained by the authorities, was to avoid distress to the families of the pilots.

Nobody knows what happened because the final report has yet to be issued. Speculate all you want (but be aware of defamation laws and the fact that the authorities are trying to protect the families) but it is just that, speculation.