Another great legacy from David Cameron' days in power. Goes nicely with
the other (only?) one: the wind turbine on one of his houses that would
have paid for itself after 40 years of use (maintenance costs not
From the article, "53 million of them are due to be installed". That's
almost one each for every man woman and child in the UK. 53 million
meters for £11b = £207 per installation resulting in a saving of £11 per
year - or a break even payback of 19 years, and for a gas meter with a
non-user replaceable battery life of 10 years (or less).
On the radio this morning I liked the phrase from one of the people in
charge of the smart meter roll out that smart meters give the consumers
full control over how they use electricity as though those of us without
such a meter have our consumption controlled by a third party.
The same person suggested that we would get meaningful savings from our
investment. I would gladly invest in my own smart meter if he could
prove that £11 per year projected saving was a lot more than the cost
of the meter plus installation. Yes, I do realise that I'm actually
paying for one in my bill whether I have one or not!
Is there any meaningful data to back up the projected energy savings, or
even money savings for the consumer? Could it be that someone has looked
into the energy use in a household before and after a smart meter
installation and not factored in that the light bulbs have been replaced
with LED and many appliances have been changed in the normal course of
events with items that use less energy or now automatically switch off
when not in use?
On a similar subject, changing energy suppliers. On personal experience,
one to avoid is GreenStar Energy. Long story short, for me I cannot get
them to give me a final bill when I changed to another supplier. There
is nothing special on my account, they have my monthly readings, they
have been taking regular monthly DD payments, the DD is still open and I
believe that I'm slightly in credit with them. Switching is meant to be
hassle free and up to now has been for me - this time I'll have to
contact the energy ombudsman.
On Saturday, 21 July 2018 07:43:03 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
of £11 per
If smart meters made economic sense there would be no need for government i
nvolvement. Energy companies would offer a tiny incentive to have them when
meters are due for replacement & everyone would benefit.
There is of course no mechanism by which they save energy. Once people see
what tiny amounts can be saved by making life a pain they typically abandon
any further attempt at energy saving, thus if anything they tend to increa
To save very much at all you have to become rather anal about turning
lights and devices off. Nobody can keep that up for very long. The best
way is for devices themselves to go into a low power mode if not turned
off, but these days they mostly do that for themselves anyway. And I
would anyway rather keep complete control of when my fridge goes
on/off, thanks. Likewise the cooker. Odd that, ain't it?
"Once you adopt the unix paradigm, the variants cease to be a problem - you
bitch, of course, but that's because bitching is fun, unlike M$ OS's, where
Did I say the world hadn't survived time sensitive tariffs ?
I noted that they would be needed in energy supply (I am aware of Economy
7) if savings were to be predicated upon changing usage patterns with
respect to time.
Only with a few hiccups. There was a huge row in Cambs when the infamous
new GTR timetable had a side effect of shifting the first off-peak train
for local commuters twenty minutes later (to a 09:36 arrival in
Cambridge) which hit a lot of people trying to get to work for 09:30.
There have also been many rows about the introduction of late afternoon
peak periods, on flows when none previously existed.
Then there was the great "simplification" of fares about ten years ago
with much renaming of tickets, which bumped the cheapest returns to
London for a large number of longer distance passengers to close to
midday, forcing them to buy a significantly more expensive ticket if
they had any business in the late morning to conduct.
That’s always been one point of smart meters, recording when
you use the power, so you can have time sensitive tariffs which
encourage people to use some non time critical devices like
water heaters, washing machines and dishwashers when there
isnt peak demand for power.
Smart meters may all have the ability to record usage in time-based
registers, but in the UK none of the suppliers have time based tariffs,
indeed having an economy7 installation seems to be a bar to having one
They don’t determine the rate either. The plan you sign up
for sets that when the suppliers start having time of use tariffs.
And the supplier doesn’t charge what they like either, if they
have to specify what rate they will charge in each time band
at the time you sign up for that particular plan.
Except, for many people, those are not time insensitive.
When your child comes home from school with a dirty blazer, PE kit, etc.
and needs it the next day, you do not want to be waiting 'til late on to
wash, dry and iron it.
If you have eaten late, you do not want to be messing about emptying and
loading the dishwasher when you are ready to go to bed either. You do it
when you get in after work, to clear the kitchen ready for preparing food.
Time based electricity pricing will dictate when people can carry out
parts of their daily life and will impact particularly on workers,
parents and carers.
Few are in that situation. Most have enough of a clue
to have more than one copy of PE kit and so don’t need
to be waiting till late on to do that stuff and don’t put
the blazer in the washing machine anyway.
Only a fool runs the dishwasher after every evening meal.
But you don’t have to run it then, you are free to run it just
before you go to bed with a delayed start programmed too.
Only those who don’t have enough of a clue to have enough PE
kit so that that it has to be washed, dried and ironed overnight.
We have a small kitchen with limited storage area so don't
have room for vast amounts of crockery.
We have a slim line dishwasher because (a) there are only the
two of us and (b) we don't have room for a full size one.
When we finish our evening meal, the dishwasher is full, so we
run it and dry everything so that we have clean crockery for
the automatic tea-maker.
We only run it if it is full. If it isn't, which does happen
on occasion, then the crockery for the next morning is hand
washed and the dishwasher is run during the following day
after it is full again.
What is foolish about that?
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