OT on line banking

[Dave]

Thanks for a simple and straightforward answer.

Dave

[Terry Casey]

I used to have a SecureID fob for accessing the company's intranet over the internet.

It continuously displayed a 'randomly' generated number which changed every minute. To gain access, as part of the log on proceedure you had to enter this number before it expired. Each key had a unique 'seed' which determined the random pattern so that only my fob would work on my account.

I think the bank machines use the same principle, except that the 'seed' is generated by the card - hence anybody can use any machine but, obviously, only their own card.

My machine is provided by Nationwide.

The first time I used it, there was a problem and I had to try it more than once. As expected, the number changed after a short time. (This problem was obviously a hiccup with Nationwide's server, as it worked perfectly the following day and any other time I've used it.)

The trademark embossed into the plastic housing (on the back) is Xiring. How does this compare with rteaders provided by other banks?

[John Rumm]

Kind off. The bank systems don't use any concept of real time however. The "time" which is used as one of the seeds to the algorithm is just a transaction count that is stored on the card. So for example. if you take a card, and generate 5 login hashes, and write them down, you will be able to use those days or weeks later to login - crossing one off the list after each use.

They use the machine in the same way as barclays and a number of others.

Its cosmetically different but otherwise identical in technical terms. You can use it with other banks and cards in many cases.

[Dr Hfuhruhurr]

Sorry if I'm answering stuff that's already been answered but.... The Card reader is to enable the setup of payments for Bills (credit card/Gas/leccy and all that stuff and other people with other banks). This is to make sure if someone DID get your lgin details, they wouldn't be able to set up payments to themselves or anyone else unless they had your Debit Card and your PIN. When you set up a payment to a new 3rd party you have a code you type into the card reader (after you've alrady typed in your Debit Card PIN) and then type the response this produces back into the web page to authorise the setup.

Hope this helps

Doc

[Dr Hfuhruhurr]

Almost but not quite right. It's a challenge/response type system. The website produces the challenge which you type into the card read, you type the response back into the web page. Otherwise known as two factor authentication. Something you have (a Debit Card) and something you know (the PIN)

[Bob Eager]

My NatWest one is from Xiring.

[Terry Fields]

Who cares?!

For one-off payments, write a cheque.

For regular ones, write to your bank with an instruction.

None of this sodding about with pin-sentry...and I do a fair amount of online banking.

TF

[Terry Fields]

oops..I guess 'paperless banking' means no cheques.

Time to change banks, perhaps?

TF

[Invisible Man]

Cheques apparently are not going to be around much longer.

I rate it safer to pay by on-line transfer than post a cheque. Just need to be very careful you don't get any account details wrong.

My mother wrote to Lloyds giving them all the details they needed for 2 standing orders. They sent her a form for one and a confusing letter. After she rang them up they sent her a second form for the second standing order. I can set one up on the internet in a very few minutes.

[chris French]

In message , Terry Fields writes

Well, yes I do sometimes, but often it means finding an envelope, and a stamp. If I owe a remote friend some money a bank transfer is easiest for us all really.

for the regualr payments (I assume you mean standing orders) then I don't need the reader anyway -certainly not after setting it up anyway.

I'd rather use the card reader than faff around with letters etc.

[Andy Champ]

The very first mortgage payment I ever made was done through a standing order.

The bank paid it twice.

They seemed to think it would be OK if they just didn't pay the next months one. I did point out to them this would leave me a teeny bit short. OK that was a while ago, before my kids left home. Or in fact were even born... but... last month we got a letter from the council threatening us with legal action for not paying our council tax. They'd somehow managed to file this month's payment (but not last months!) in a suspense account. So nothing's changed.

Andy

[Ronald Raygun]

Luckily the suspense did not kill you.

[Dr Hfuhruhurr]

Cheque Guarantee scheme closes in June next year and cheques themselves are due to be phased out in 2018.

[Tim Watts]

How do they propose I pay a tradesman or buy a second hand car?

Just curious...

[Dr Hfuhruhurr]

That remains to be seen :) The UK Payments Council have mobilised a series of steering groups to undertake a review of the future of credit clearing, with a primary focus on mobile, internet and contacless technologies.

..blank stare...

In other words, they don't know yet.

[Tim Watts]

Or they could leave a working system alone. Once the shops and utility companies stop taking cheques (and a lot already have) they volumes will be a fraction of what they used to be so they could slim down the cheque clearing houses - perhaps just have a couple.

[Dave Liquorice]

Cash. Nice, soon to be 20%, discount for cash...

But an interesting point. I don't use many cheques these days but I do have a couple of "tradesmen" bills coming soon that I will probably be writing cheques for. Both are for more than I'd like to carry about as cash, one will be over 2K...