OT Damned Traffic lights

[DerbyBorn]

Our council seems to see traffic lights as the solution to every problem - when in many cases a little bit of junction widening to allow better filtering would improve situations.

The problem with traffic lights is the way they cause the random (ish) flow to become solid platoons of vehicles. This becomes inpenetrable to any traffic wanting to join or cross the flow so it in turn becomes a platoon if it can escape from a side road. At least without traffic lights, sooner or later there would be a gap in the random traffic to allow side turns to escape.

Is this seen as a problem or is it just me?

[alan_m]

It's not just you. My local council has been improving road safety for the past 10 years or more.

Every pedestrian crossing now has red light timing suitable for the slowest of slow disabled person to cross. 99.999% of pedestrians are across the road and half a mile further on before traffic is allowed to flow again.

Every 4 way road junction with lights now has a right filter light for each direction. The amount of dead time at these junctions where nothing moves is excessive.

The council has even managed to install both of the above within 20 metres of each other but not synchronise the light changes. One can sit in a long queue at a red light on the crossing and watch the next light at the junction sequence through to green back to red without letting a single car through.

While the above tends to create periods of bunched traffic followed by periods of no traffic this doesn't help when there is also a policy of traffic clamming implemented by road narrowing which causes the traffic to bunch up and crawl along. This leaves no gaps for pedestrians to cross so the solution is more pedestrian crossing with long red light timing.

And then having made driving anywhere on the main routes into the town so painful they wonder why the high street shopping is dying.

[T i m]

I love it where the lights are out on a crossroads or roundabout with lights and the traffic always seems to flow better. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[alan_m]

+1 on roundabouts where often cars parked on the roundabout waiting for the lights to change block the exits for the cars coming around having a green light.

I know of one roundabout where they tried to stop this by introducing the cross hatched yellow box. Unfortunately the box extends so far around the bend that when entering the box it's impossible to see that the letter half of it is free of traffic.

[tabbypurr]

It does, mostly. Current traffic light policies are too often crassly stupi d. Eg red light at pedestrian crossings instead of flashing yellow, red lig ht at junctions instead of an illuminated give way sign. Even a moron could work this out, but not our dear government.

NT

[dennis]

That's because the stupid drivers pull away when the amber started to flash before the pedestrians had finished crossing.

Modern crossings can detect the pedestrian on the crossing and change as needed. That is until a stupid driver crosses the line and the IR camera thinks the engine heat is a pedestrian and it stays red for longer.

[alan_m]

That would suggest that the lights would change as soon as the pedestrian has crossed - This doesn't happen

This is not the case either unless EVERY single car that ever stops at the lights is being detected! They wouldn't fit IR cameras and PIRs would only detect moving objects , not stationary objects/cars.

[FMurtz]

The dutch, and now the germans have much better ideas,

[alan_m]

Southend seafront has such a scheme and the first serious accident was between a pedestrian and a cyclist. For motor vehicles there is a 20 mph limit enforced by average speed cameras although when a lot of pedestrians are around the average speed can drop to between 0 mph and 2 mph and most locals avoid it. My neighbour had to go on a speed awareness coarse after exceeding the limit there at 6am.

[mark.bluemel]

On Thursday, 21 September 2017 21:38:45 UTC+1, alan_m wrote: [Note this is not a criticism of Alan's typing, it just amused me]

I had an image of traffic wardens with satchels full of molluscs, pelting the passing cars...

[alan_m]

Not far wrong in Southend. The seafront area has parking charges 24/365 and hence a large contingent of traffic warden enforcement. When the weather is inclement and the take of car parking by the sea is slight the wardens migrate inland and pelt cars in the side streets and inner town car parks with parking tickets. Currently their favourite targets seem to be vehicles with blue badges since the council has adopted a policy of not offering free parking in council car parks to badge holders living outside the borough.

[Brian Gaff]

Often the problem is crossings. One needs them to be there, and its really bad manners on the drivers side that makes them absolutely required. Back when I were a lad, uncontrolled crossings were safe as people saw you standing there and stopped, nowadays, no more Mr or Ms Nice person I'm afraid. This also seems to be an issue with cyclists who seem to believe traffic lights are only advisory. Brian

[alan_m]

Perhaps motorists have become so frustrated with being held up for long periods at every crossing/junction. Being polite these days adds significantly to the journey time in town traffic.!

Don't cyclists pretend that they a pedestrians at lights and just use the pavement where the rules of the road don't apply?

[Nightjar]

There is one side road I use regularly where often the only chance I have to get out is when lights stop the traffic coming from my right.

[soup]

The best kind of naked streets have no cars in them . There are very few reasons for private cars to be in cities . Not 'no' just very few.

Delivery lorries and vans, workmen's vans, cars for the disabled yes. but very few private cars. Especially nowadays with internet shopping and virtually all other goods capable of being delivered. Yes this does make "high street shopping" harder but in a city, like this one, [Edinburgh] it is very hard to park legally and very expensive when a space is found.

Local to me so not applicable everywhere:- I live on a main commuter route with a very underused park and ride just along the road a bit but, I still see lots and lots of 1~2 tonne lumps of metal with ONE person in them going into town.

[alan_m]

All very well to rely on public transport unless you want to travel between 6pm and 9am and on a Sunday or bank holiday. Strangely, private and council public transport runs on cherry picked routes and times.

[Andrew Gabriel]

Back when I was at school, the local town traffic planner came and gave us a talk. It was the first time I heard about Queueing Theory (a branch of maths not taught before university), and his talk was very interesting, going into the science of road design, throughput, transit delay, road buffering capacity, etc.

Councils long ago lost those skills, and started subcontracting junction designs out, usually to companies who don't know the area. Even most of those companies no longer have the skills to do proper junction design, and they tend to be influenced by politicians now.

What you are seeing is the loss of the science based skills necessary to design road schemes that work correctly, combined with the interference of politicians who are completely clueless on the topic.

[Huge]

And then Councils wonder why their High Streets are dying ...

[Huge]

[56 lines snipped]

Even though I'm one of the country's biggest petrolheads, I agree. In the 30-odd years I worked in London, I think I drove in maybe three or four times, and those outside rush hour. The problem is that few cities have sufficient public transport, and when they do, it's a deeply unpleasant experience to use it.

[Huge]

[23 lines snipped]

*applause*

s/on the topic//;