what I probably want is a reasonable-sized hatchback
The following was my response to a similar thread in april 2003 (can't get the link to work, anyone else stuggle with the new google groups search engine?)
CITROEN BX 1.7TZD 1992
Huge flat load area with plastic runners on the carpet to protect it, integral roof bars, excellent self leveling suspension for heavy loads (I just bought 45 120 x 90 foil backed plasterboards home in one), adjustable suspension height for bumpy builders yards and easy loading (lower it right down to load/unload the roof rack, just pump it right up to unload the heavy stuff out of the boot)
60x40 split rear seats
low insurance, and as its mostly plastic, you get about 50mpg! (obviously without the plasterboards in!)
Spend the rest on some more DIY!
You can now pick one up for =A3500! Mine is still going strong. It has a towbar and regularly tows my lark dinghy and 4 mountain bikes while loaded with the family and enough luggage to sink a battleship. It's done 143000 miles so far and used no oil - sailed through MOT in November at no cost.
The time travelling feature is definitely a plus-point. I could time travel to May next year when all the work is done and I don't need it any more. Where can I get one?
Thanks for the input. A "lip" certainly has its advantages. When I had a hatchback I sometimes carried large objects with the hatch open. The lip preventsed all my little bits of shopping and other junk spilling out. Of course, it would be quite easy to make an artificial "lip" out of plywood or something. Then, if you have a lipless car, you have the advantage of choosing whether to drive with or without the lip in place. On thing I like about hatchbacks is is that if you do drive with the hatch open (to acommodate a large object), the open door doesn't increase the overal length of the vehicle. Whereas an open estate car tailgate usually sticks out beyond the normal length of the car. Admittedly, though, the internal carrying space in an estate is usually longer than a hatchback. The ideal car, in my mind, would be one with a long gently-sloping hatch that would open to an almost vertical position. You could then carry tall objects sticking upwards out of the hatch opening, as well as protruding backwards to the rear if necessary. What's more, when the hatch is shut, it would be more streamlined than most cars. I saw such a car just the other day, but couldn't see the make or model from where I was sitting.
Vauxhall Cavalier. Was quite a good size which was one reason it displaced Fords in many fleets. No 4*4 that I recall but it handled okay and had very good seats.
A split tailgate was one feature which convinced me to buy my current car, Fiat Marea estate. Normally the "bumper" part forms a 5" high lip to keep stuff from rolling out of the boot. But it drops down to give a flat load space when need. I've carted long timber (16') back from the BM by leaving just the lower tailgate open with the timber sticking out the back. Very useful workhorse car last year when I was building "The Shed" (tm), materials kit boxes, tool boxes, saw bench, mitre saws, more toolboxes all transported with ease.
My other life (regular mountain biking trips) means I wouldn't now consider anything other than an estate car, pref a TD.
On 2 Jan 2005 09:08:55 -0800, "Philip" strung together this:
I'd go for something similar, if I got a decent one. I've just got a
2000 Laguna estate for work and the back sinks quite a bit even with just the tools and drills in the boot.
The Citroen Xantia\BX\XM has the height adjustable suspension so is more suited to carrying loads. My Dad's just got a '94 XM 2.5TD and it's got acres of space, and the rear end is level when it's full or empty.
He's had a '95 Xantia 1.9TD since new and clocked up quite few miles without any major costs over the years. Before that he had a 1988 BX
17RD (1.7 Diesel) Which did 185,000 miles in between new and replacement with the Xantia and that was only got rid of because the spheres were just starting to get expensive to maintain.
Considering only buying and running costs, an old Metro is the only small hatchback that I know of which will carry an 8 x 4 sheet internally--much to my surprise!
Hmm I had an old metro - went all over Europe in it, the horror the horror :-) - anyway there's no way you could fit in an 8X4 internally. Do you mean flat or diagonal and sticking out the back? Or maybe sliced up into little pieces? :-)
Yup see what you are saying... personally I have never found the need, if it does not go in, then it goes on (the roof rack). I have never been fond of driving round with boot/hatch lids flapping.
With the Legacy then no, even the Turbo version is very discrete in its standard trim.
See:
formatting link
have a saloon, not unlike the white one in the first picture, but with the colour and the wheels of the estate pictured below).
It is probably fair to say that there are only a few styling cues that give the game away. The non turbo one lacks the spoiler, the air scoop on the bonnet, and the factory fitted front fogs. The tyres are lower profile and wider.
With the Impreza, then its is a bit more obvious (especially on later models) with its large "carry handle" spoiler, bonnet vents etc. They have acquired the reputation of being quick, partly because the majority you see are Turbos, with sales of the conventional car being quite low. (they do a "sport" version now, with the Turbo "eye candy" but no turbo, for people who want the pose but not the group 17 insurance)
(performance of the non turbo models is certainly good for the class, but probably no better that the equivalent Mundano / Focus)
Well I have had various Subarus over a 20 year time frame, and have never really considered parts availability to be a big issue. I can only think of a couple of occasions where I have needed to wait a couple of days for a part. I does help to have access to a dealer that knows the cars though. Generally the situation has got better with time as the brand profile has risen (I no longer have conversations with people that go "What do you drive?", "Oh Subaru, is that made by Nissan"!)
Most things that you will need at a service are "off the shelf" bits, and are available from multiple sources anyway. Some other things (exhausts etc) are easy to get, but don't expect a quick fit to have one on the shelf without a bit of advanced warning (bit of a non issue - the exhausts are SS and last 12 years+ anyway). Most glass repairers will have no difficulty supplying a windscreen. Break discs, radiators etc are also available from recon factories.
If you like getting bits from scappies then it is really a case of pot luck.
After market parts for Imprezas are widely available because a whole industry has sprung up round them for performance tuning etc.
formatting link
like a headlamp glass however could still be pricey if you go for a original part.
Having said all that; given the price range you are looking at, you would probably need to go for a non turbo Legacy anyway, since Imprezas tend to hold their value very well. Even a Legacy turbo at 1500 quid will be hard to find.
If you really want a 4WD car (as opposed to off roader) in your price range, then there are relatively few other options that I can think of. You may find a suitable Audi quatro, or the Sierra others have mentioned. There was a cavalier that never worked in 4WD mode, there were also things like the Toyota Tercell which was a dog.
Note that the Impreza, even the five door, seems to have been designed to be 'almost' big enough to carry most things. Note that in the four door the seats stil fold very flat and the rear screen is quite high up so there is quite a lot of load space. It is a great car but if you need space the Legacy is the better choice.
The lack of a 4*4 Focus is a problem though.
Subraus rarely need spares. In all my time with them the only thing that has failed is a clip in the driver door mirror. This failed going over a speedbump. Apparently this is a common problem that for some reason they haven't fixed. Perhaps this indicates there are no speedbumps in Japan ?
Our old car was a Scenic and the amount of crap that you can fit in it is amazing. The rear seats fold and/or remove and it has the capacity of a van. There is no lip at the boot so lifting in and out is easy. More height than an estate. Should be able to get a '97 for around £1,500 - £1,700. There are truly loved by owners. 1.6l and only group 6 insurance too.
We loved ours so much we replaced it with a Grande Scenic - would not recommend it, btw.
I did try out a five door Impreza turbo before I bought my Legacy, and in the end came to the conclusion that I valued the extra space and practicality of the bigger car more than the extra performance of the smaller one. Given that I was moving up from a non turbo Legacy then jump in performance was huge either way.
I would go along with that...
Either that, or there are so many people you can't actually move!
Continuing my love afair with citroen - I once collected an 8 x 4 sheet of hardboard home in a citroen dyanne.
I fannyed about for several minutes in the local wickes carpark trying to figure out how to fit it in. It finally went down through the rolled back canvas roof and aft into the rear passenger space. Drove home to greenwich with 3-4 foot poking out the top and no rear visibility - this was the aspect that caused the crash...
Incidentally - there was a 4x4 citroen BX 1.9GTi. One sold last month on ebay for =A3100. Spend the remaining =A31,400 on repairs and you could have a decent car! (this is not a serious suggestion - the repairs are likely to be v expensive)
finally - Suspension problems are a myth in my experience. I have spent loads on the car since having it, but only =A3300 on the suspension. The main problem component on an old BX is the "octopus" which is a series of rubber low pressure pipes that return LHM suspension fluid to the reservoir. On an old BX with dodgy suspension - this is the most likely problem. It will cost =A3100-=A3150 to replace. The other thing to look out for is the rear trailing arm bearings. if the rear wheels "toe out" then these need replacing (=A3200). Take it to a specialist garage and don't listen to the other mechanics who don't really understand the system. If you buy a car for =A3300-500 when you have a buget of =A31500
- you can afford to have the problems put right at the onset. Regards
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.