Kitchen unit fitting sequence - base then wall cupboards?

[David]

We are about to use kitchen units from Benchmarx to fit out an office.

Nothing much; just one tall wall cupboard and two pan drawer units.

I've downloaded the fitting instructions and hints, and one thing is that it recommends fitting the run of base units before fitting the wall units above.

My expectation was that you would fit the wall units first when you could easily get at the wall, then fit the base units second.

Is "base units first" always the standard way (perhaps to make sure the wall units are exactly aligned with the base units) or doesn't it make much difference?

Cheers

Dave R

[newshound]

Personally I do wall units first because then you have easier access for drilling without the base units getting in the way. The other thing I have done for a long time is to fit a batten first, which all the base units rest on. This is to carry the main weight, then the top fittings only have to apply a tensile force to stop the units from rotating away from the wall. The batten is not particularly visible (especially if you use doors that are "higher" than the cabinets) and I tend to fit screw hooks into them to hang kitchen spoons, etc.

With the batten first, it is usually only a one person job even to fit double width wall units. Batten first also helps if you have "difficult" walls. I have in the past used units that "hang" on high hooks that you fit to the wall first, but it is more difficult to get the units level and at the same height.

[Lee Nowell]

I can't see it makes too much difference but a couple of thoughts

1. If you have tall larder units you would want to fit them first so the tops of the wall units align with it
2. If the floor was drastically out fitting the base units first would get the correct height off the worksurface (would have to be very out though and you would for some reason want to be super exact on distance from work surface to wall units!)
3. You can rest the wall unit on the base unit so you only have to lift from there.
4. Stops you banging you head on the wall unit when you bend down to get a screw for the next one :)

[John]

newshound [e-mail]> wrote in news: [e-mail]:

A length of Dexion type angle is less obvious than a batten. The fixing to the wall is hidden by the cupboards. (if you fit it the right way)

[newshound]

Means a visible gap if you have an exposed end, though.

[newshound]

Having seen too many base units with chipboard down to the floor gone soggy following water leaks, I'd only ever fit units on those adjustable plastic pillars.

I used to do that, before I discovered the batten trick.

[Chris Green]

As long as the fixings are sound I don't see any necessity for these. Hanging the cupboards on screws will exert most force in shear and the 'pull out' force will be similar with or without the support at the bottom. Admittedly our walls are very solid, I might go for something extra on a stud wall, but in a stud wall I think I'd simply search for the timber and fix directly or indirectly to that.

A well fixed steel screw will hold an incredible weight in shear. My rule of thumb for steel's strength is 40 tons/sq in which gives a shear strength of somewhere around a ton for a 5mm screw. The screw will probably fall out first of course but I do always wonder why people use great fat fixings for holding a few tens of kilograms. Nearly all my fixings are 3.5mm or 4mm screws in yellow plugs and I can assure you they *don't* fall out or break.

[newshound]

How? Particularly for "ordinary" carcases with a hardboard back. You either fit a top batten with the hanger type fittings, or some sort of intermediate batten attached to the carcase that you can screw through, or a batten at the bottom that immediately ensures that all your units are horizontal, and aligned vertically.

This is all true. However with a rendered random stone wall you will be lucky to get any wall plug within half an inch vertically or horizontally of where you actually want it, once you manage to get a secure fixing.

I agree life is much easier in a modern house with decent brickwork or blockwork.

[Andy Burns]

Rather than fit the two little mounting brackets in the top corners of each wall cabinet, you can buy it in 2 metre long rails, saves faffing about measuring where they'll go

[tabbypurr]

Many do. Some suffer from masonry crumbling, or the masonry simply snaps. Most people fail to clear the dust out, resulting in a weak bond. And the ida that you can reliably safely support a ton on a bit of 5mm wire sideways strikes me as decidedly optimistic.

NT

[Chris Green]

I wasn't suggesting supporting a ton on one screw, I was just pointing out that big screws are unnecessary. It is of course necessary to ensure that the screw is soundly fixed in the wall which, I find, doesn't depend much on the size of the screw. *Longer* screws often help but *fatter* screws are not a lot of help.

[GB]

[John]

I always think the older type screws were better as the root of the thread was tapered. Modern screws are parallel therefore they don,t wedge tighter as they are driven in - they also tend to cut into the plug rather than force it open.

[dennis]

That would be why you don't use self cutting screws with plugs.

[tabbypurr]

You were. I was pointing out that was not correct. Maybe you're upto speed now.

[Chris Green]

I said:-

That doesn't mean one *should* support so much on a single screw, it was just pointing out that it's not the screw that is the limiting factor when fixing things to the wall.

[John]

"dennis@home" [e-mail] wrote in news:Vhd8F.91715$ [e-mail]:

They are getting hard to avoid and are often provided with items,

[tabbypurr]

IME it's more often the masonry around the screw or the packing between the 2.

NT

[dennis]

look for chipboard screws, they are seldom self drilling as its just as bad in MDF and chipboard as in plugs.

[Vir Campestris]

.. And thanks everyone, I just had to put a cupboard up today. Batten method worked well. SWMBO could hold the cupboard on the batten while I screwed it to the wall.

Andy