installing flue for leaky chimney

[lesshaste]

I have just had a smoke test done on my victorian brick chimney and found that smoke comes out of two chimney pots on my roof. As a result it seems I need a new steel flue liner. I have asked for quotes for installation and apart from the fact that the "Corgi" engineer turned out not to be the quotes were astronomical. So, to DIY...

It seems that what I need is a 316 grade multi fuel liner, minimum diameter is 175mm (7"). The price appears to be 21.14 per metre which isn't too bad (especially compared to the 60 pounds a metre I was quoted by the guy who wanted to do the installation). There are also fairly clearish instructions at

it seems. However, is there anything I should know before embarking on this?

For example, what is the situation with the chimney "certificate" that seems to be needed before you can have a gas fire attached. Clearly a certificate written by me doesn't seem quite right :) Of course all I have currently is a fail from the chimney sweep.

Raphael

[lesshaste]

Actually 37.42/metre... I got the wrong price.

Raphael

[tarquinlinbin]

The first issue really is to consider what happened to Rod Hull!!.

Do you feel comfortable working at heights? do you have a decent ladder & cat ladder & fall arrest equipment?

The common product for this job is referred to as Copex liner (brand name),,there will be others. Basically you tie a rope and weight to one end,drop it down the chimney,one poor soul is on the roof feeding it down,the other poor soul is at the botoom pulling the rope and getting full of soot. Dont forget to nail a dust sheet up across the fire opening to contain the mess,put dust sheets down,wear dust masks. You then need to ensure that it is properly terminated and sealed at both ends

joe

[BigWallop]

Look for Kopex flue liners for this job. Kopex is a tight wound flexible liner, not an actual flue, that will allow you to take routes through the old chimney that more rigid liners will not.

Kopex is a bit cheaper and is a lot easier to install through the pot on the roof. The pot will also need a cowl to prevent blow down with a new gas fire in place.

Some people will say that Kopex is illegal as a flue, and they would be correct in saying this, but you are not using it as an actual flue, you're only using it as a chimney liner which is perfectly OK to do.

Cut your costs and go with Kopex.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Flexible liners are only allowed on chimneys built before IIRC 1969.

and they would be

You have got it all a bit muddled.

A flue is whathot gases go up. You cn use that to mean anythig fron te chimney brickwork itslef, to teh linerr itself, to teh whole lot togeher.

What I susect you are syaing is that one can buy double skinned insulated and expensive 'flues' that doen't need the brickwork.

I ws forced to install these for an aga and wood burning stove in my NEW house with NEW ceramic lined brick chimneys.

[lesshaste]

I am little confused. The house was built in 1883 and I have been told that I need a multifuel 316 double skinned flue liner (37.42 as said above) as I am installing an open gas fire (the ones that look like a coal fire but are actually gas). Is this wrong?

Also, what about this certificate that you seem to need before a CORGI person will connect your gas fire?

Raphael

[The Natural Philosopher]

I think that is a double skinned flexible. Allowed on old chimbleys.

The real McCoy is stainless steel dual pipes filled with solid insulation. Not flexible at all. About 20 quid a meter.

Pass. I don't have gas.

[MJ]

Not according to some people around here.........

MJ

[Ed Sirett]

This is how I would repsond. Someone asks me to fit a gas fire in the fire place. Me: Have you had the chimney swept? You: Well it's just had a flue liner installed. Me: So much the better.

I then test the lined chminey it passes the flue flow test, there's smoke out of only one chimney, it has an approved terminal, there's no smoke in the loft or elsewhere in the house. The liner is properly terminated into a box in the builders opening or a register plate at the bottom of the chimney.

I fit the fire.

[lesshaste]

It seems that Kopex may not be a good suggestion after all. All the advice I have got from shops and chimney specialists is that I need a class 1 liner (which Kopex isn't) unless I buy one of the rare gas fires that can cope with class 2 or Kopex.

Seems that I may have had a disaster on my hands if I had bought Kopex after all :)

Raphael

[Ed Sirett]

A quick trawl through the instruction for several gas fires shows about half as being suitable for _any_ flue type.

[L Reid]

year. Both required liners (as our chimney was breached), but were told the regulations had changed with respect to open gas fires so a flexible class 2 liner was fine. This cost around £360 or so, including fitting (though this might have been for both of them and not just one).

If I were you I'd check out whether a class 2 liner will actually do as this is a lot cheaper.

HTH.

[lesshaste]

You couldn't tell me who did the work could you?

Raphael

[L Reid]

I could but that's probably not a lot of use to you unless you live in Edinburgh. There were two places I had quotes for getting this done, neither of which were 'national' companies. However one was a small gas appliance shop that also did fitting (they actually did it - a company called World of Gas that'll pop up on Yell for edinburgh), and another was by a small company that sweep and repair chimneys, though they only really do sweeping now, but will fit the class 2 liners as they're not generally a lot of hastle. I'd put 'chimney sweeps' in the yell for your area (or look in the yellow pages) and get a couple of opinions from there.

Good luck!

[lesshaste]

Thanks very much. I have, at last found and understood the regulations. They are best summaried by a quote from the NACE website.

"TECHNICAL FILE T300 N2 O D 1- LININGS FOR GAS FIRES There have been many people fitting single skin flexible flue liners for use with gas fires. Approved document J Table 3.2 states that the category of flue liner required for a gas fire is:

• T300 N2 O D 1

All of the single skin liners currently on the market are only rated at T250 and so are suitable for gas boiler flues but not gas fires. It is important, as you now sign a form to say your installation conforms with approved Document J that you ensure you are using the correct liner for the correct job.

All the solid fuel rated liners are T 450 N2 S D 3 and so are a higher rating than needed and so can be used with gas fires. " (Mine is a gallery arch tray mc bg2 DFE fire)

The plot thickens... :)

Raphael